Zephyr Teachout

And then in Citizens United, supercharged that by allowing corporate spending. So in New York, to be particular about housing and the subway, it meant that the real estate board of New York has this outsized power in state politics and gets just a lot of giveaways that most people think didn't make that big a difference and led to really expensive per square footage housing.

And then in Citizens United, supercharged that by allowing corporate spending. So in New York, to be particular about housing and the subway, it meant that the real estate board of New York has this outsized power in state politics and gets just a lot of giveaways that most people think didn't make that big a difference and led to really expensive per square footage housing.

So that sort of occupied the space on housing. And then it led to New York state government under Andrew Cuomo first starving the subway. So then it had to spend all its money doing fixes that would have been much cheaper to fix earlier. And something that I do think you point out in the book, which is they also starved state capacity.

So that sort of occupied the space on housing. And then it led to New York state government under Andrew Cuomo first starving the subway. So then it had to spend all its money doing fixes that would have been much cheaper to fix earlier. And something that I do think you point out in the book, which is they also starved state capacity.

you know, they really said, let's consult everything out and pay big consultants. But that is downstream from the centralized corporate power over politics. And I think one of the things that's underappreciated is how enervating big money politics is, is how it drains politicians of dynamism, is how much big donors actually want government to not act.

you know, they really said, let's consult everything out and pay big consultants. But that is downstream from the centralized corporate power over politics. And I think one of the things that's underappreciated is how enervating big money politics is, is how it drains politicians of dynamism, is how much big donors actually want government to not act.

not just in the lobbying front, which we've talked about earlier, but in talking to whether it's governors or congressmen, is that their tendency is towards no as opposed towards dynamism. And when you actually have a popular politics, people want to exercise that power.

not just in the lobbying front, which we've talked about earlier, but in talking to whether it's governors or congressmen, is that their tendency is towards no as opposed towards dynamism. And when you actually have a popular politics, people want to exercise that power.

Yeah. So I love the question. And I think it is sort of just telling the truth about the nature of how power is organized in society today. And I don't think it's just a few instances. I mean, this may be an area of difference. I think that the major enervating power is actually... centralized corporate power. And I think you'll find it in area after area after area.

Yeah. So I love the question. And I think it is sort of just telling the truth about the nature of how power is organized in society today. And I don't think it's just a few instances. I mean, this may be an area of difference. I think that the major enervating power is actually... centralized corporate power. And I think you'll find it in area after area after area.

So let's talk about green energy. You're probably familiar with the New York Sabin School, and they come out with this report fairly regularly on where are there checks on local rules against green energy building. And so I took a look at it the other day and it's majority red districts in New York.

So let's talk about green energy. You're probably familiar with the New York Sabin School, and they come out with this report fairly regularly on where are there checks on local rules against green energy building. And so I took a look at it the other day and it's majority red districts in New York.

And it looks like around the country that there's these new rules that come in that say you can't build solar.

And it looks like around the country that there's these new rules that come in that say you can't build solar.

Right. Green energy has become a culture war. And so I look at that and I say, I have a very clear story of where that came from. That came from 2010 when the Koch brothers decided to threaten every single Republican who dared use the word climate change in a primary.

Right. Green energy has become a culture war. And so I look at that and I say, I have a very clear story of where that came from. That came from 2010 when the Koch brothers decided to threaten every single Republican who dared use the word climate change in a primary.

And took something that in the McCain era had been Republicans and Democrats both thinking about green energy in the future and turned it into a culture war and then are going to local communities and saying, here, I've got a way to block your green energy project.

And took something that in the McCain era had been Republicans and Democrats both thinking about green energy in the future and turned it into a culture war and then are going to local communities and saying, here, I've got a way to block your green energy project.

And the difference between you and me, I think, probably, is that if I were to go to, say, Western New York or places where these—and by the way, these are very significant blocks. You know, there's 400 different blocks, 400 different projects that are being slowed in terms of solar development or wind development. There's Kathy Hochul. You know, vetoing offshore wind.

And the difference between you and me, I think, probably, is that if I were to go to, say, Western New York or places where these—and by the way, these are very significant blocks. You know, there's 400 different blocks, 400 different projects that are being slowed in terms of solar development or wind development. There's Kathy Hochul. You know, vetoing offshore wind.