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48 Hours

The Puppet Master

11 Dec 2025

Transcription

Chapter 1: What happened during the drive-by shooting involving Heather and John Grossman?

19.083 - 24.429 911 Operator

911, do you have an emergency? Yes, we do. We have a shooting in a car, a North Federal in Yamato.

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24.449 - 32.157 Troy Roberts

We have people with injuries. Oh, my God. She's, um... Please tell them we're on the way. They're on the way. They're on the way. I don't think she's bleeding.

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33.418 - 38.884 Heather Grossman

Even though the shooting happened nine years ago, it seems like it happened yesterday.

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38.924 - 48.094 Alan Johnson

He said, do you want to make some good money, around $20,000, make it look like a robbery? I thought we could get away with it.

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49.373 - 53.078 Heather Grossman

On that day, the weather was beautiful and warm.

53.138 - 55.581 Alan Johnson

Heather and John Grossman were having a normal day.

56.742 - 68.076 Heather Grossman

We were driving a black Lincoln Continental. My husband, John, was driving. And I was in the passenger front seat. And John and I were on our way to lunch.

69.457 - 91.235 Alan Johnson

Slim's driving. And he's telling Runyon what to do. I'm in the back seat. And Runyon is sitting in the back seat with a rifle. I remember going down Federal Highway and... They were about to stop at one place, and then they decided on another place, they made a U-turn. So John and I turned around. We followed them. Come up to a red light.

91.315 - 93.277 Heather Grossman

I remember coming up to a stoplight.

Chapter 2: How did Heather Grossman's life change after the shooting?

104.673 - 124.227 Alan Johnson

Slim's like, do it, do it, do it, do it. And I came up and... I stuck the weapon out the window and... And I shot into the back window and... I felt the bullet penetrate. She disappears.

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124.488 - 127.373 Heather Grossman

I remember my body shaking.

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129.867 - 135.456 Alan Johnson

Then Slim pulled up next to the car. Fired another shot and winged John Grossman in the cheek.

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138.801 - 147.876 Troy Roberts

Where is she shot? She's shot, I think, in the head or face. And she's face down in the middle. I don't want to touch her. She's all slumped over.

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148.683 - 161.475 Alan Johnson

My name is Alan Johnson. I'm Chief Assistant State Attorney at the Palm Beach County State Attorney's Office. Roger Runyon was the shooter. I attempted to kill people for money. Roger Runyon was one of the puppets. I'll go to hell.

161.495 - 164.157 Heather Grossman

Roger Runyon is the man that shot me.

164.518 - 166.76 Alan Johnson

I ruined her life. I ruined her kid's life.

167.34 - 169.222 Heather Grossman

I don't hold hatred towards him.

169.482 - 176.749 Alan Johnson

Roger Runyon is not on trial. We want the mastermind. The man that paid him to shoot. The mastermind of the crime.

Chapter 3: What role did Ron Samuels play in the events leading up to the shooting?

198.659 - 210.465 Troy Roberts

First, we had a real loud bang. About 10 seconds after that, we heard another loud bang. I've got one person shot in a black Lincoln. Also, white males sitting on the floor of the vehicle holding his finger.

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210.445 - 217.774 Alan Johnson

The first report on that October day in 1997 was that a woman had been killed in a drive-by shooting.

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217.934 - 229.669 Heather Grossman

I remember tears rolling down the sides of my cheek. I'm feeling so scared.

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230.27 - 251.119 Alan Johnson

The bullet that struck then 31-year-old Heather Grossman ripped a fist-sized hole in her neck, severing her spinal cord. The bullet that struck her husband, John Grossman, then 47, only grazed him. But Heather's life was forever changed.

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251.76 - 260.753 Heather Grossman

They explained what had happened and that I was going to be paralyzed from the neck down. That I was going to be a quadriplegic.

260.902 - 285.159 Alan Johnson

It pains me to see her crippled and helpless in that chair. Ron Samuels rushed to the scene. He was Heather's first husband and father of their three children. I was under the impression that these people were shot and killed. police were there. I said, that's my ex-wife, I think. I want to know, were there three children in the car?

285.66 - 313.366 Alan Johnson

It was that time of the day when my three kids could have been with them. The welfare of the children had always been a contentious issue in a messy custody battle, a far cry from the happier times the couple enjoyed when they met a decade earlier. Ron met Heather when she was working as a flight attendant. She was prettier than any movie star in Hollywood.

313.386 - 325.017 Alan Johnson

Samuels, a 40-year-old entrepreneur, fell hard for the former high school cheerleader from Minnesota. I was the only first-class passenger on the way back from Oregon.

325.037 - 329.582 Heather Grossman

I just talked to him a little bit. He was just a passenger.

Chapter 4: What led to the custody battle over Heather's children?

338.392 - 371.52 Alan Johnson

Soon after that flight, they moved in together. What were your impressions of him? He could charm people. They lived in Pensacola, Florida, where Samuels owned a successful car dealership. At the height, what was your net worth? in excess of $30 million. $30 million? That's right. Was he very generous? Yes, he was very generous. You spoiled your wife. I enjoyed it. We took very lavish trips.

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371.54 - 390.087 Alan Johnson

We went everywhere in the world on private jets, too. After living together for several years, in December of 1988, Heather and Ron were married. Their son Ronnie was born shortly afterwards. Two years later, they had twins, Lauren and Joe.

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391.248 - 400.057 Troy Roberts

Ronny and his dad are going to sing the Miami Dolphin fight song. Miami Dolphins number one. What do you think of that?

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400.157 - 412.51 Alan Johnson

I had three beautiful children. Look at this Ronny boy. She was an excellent mother. She was always with the children. Ben and Helen Bentfeld were good friends.

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412.709 - 415.596 Larry Das

I thought they were getting along beautifully, didn't you?

415.616 - 431.62 Alan Johnson

I thought everything was going along great. But if it all seemed perfect, behind the scenes, the marriage was beginning to crumble. I was 18 or 18 and a half years older than Heather was.

Chapter 5: How did the investigation unfold after the shooting?

432.221 - 439.532 Heather Grossman

He became controlling and rude and scary and intimidating.

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440.112 - 449.687 Alan Johnson

I expected her to understand that to live the lifestyle that she wanted, that somebody had to pay the bill. Did your arguments turn violent?

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449.987 - 458.46 Heather Grossman

Yes, they became violent. How? When I wanted to leave him, he held a gun to my head.

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458.812 - 461.735 Alan Johnson

Did you ever put a gun to her head? Never.

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461.755 - 466.158 Heather Grossman

I was terrified of him and I said, I'm out of here.

467.68 - 472.504 Alan Johnson

Heather fled with the children to her parents' home in Minnesota and filed for divorce.

472.864 - 478.77 Heather Grossman

When I left him and divorced him, he said, you know, you will pay.

478.79 - 496.211 Alan Johnson

Did you say to Heather, if you leave me, you're going to pay? Not that I recall ever saying that. Heather moved on and began dating John Grossman, the son of a business tycoon who was part owner of the Minnesota Vikings football team.

497.132 - 507.504 Heather Grossman

I had a wonderful relationship with John Grossman, and we were in love, and everything was really pretty much perfect.

Chapter 6: What was the motive behind the conspiracy to kill Heather?

574.94 - 588.547 Alan Johnson

It was during one of those visits, Samuels says his children told him that John Grossman was mistreating them. Samuels confronted Grossman on the phone.

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601.444 - 604.007 Heather Grossman

We're getting calls at night, and we're getting death threats.

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604.679 - 627.43 Alan Johnson

But was Samuels capable of carrying out those threats? If you want to know, would I have killed John Grossman? Had I had the opportunity, I definitely would have. And what about Heather? I would never do that to the lady that I watched give birth to my three children. There's no reason in the world for that.

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638.463 - 649.016 Alan Johnson

After a five-year relationship, Heather married John Grossman in June of 1997 and moved back to Florida. This was a happy time for you?

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649.036 - 654.022 Heather Grossman

Yes, a very happy time.

654.042 - 684.315 Alan Johnson

But their happiness was overshadowed by their fear of Heather's first husband, Ron Samuels. who had accused Grossman of abusing his children. Were you hurt when Heather married John Grossman? Not particularly. What were your impressions of him? I don't think I could say that on camera. Go ahead, try. He was a rotten, despicable scumbag.

686.101 - 693.25 Alan Johnson

Because of Samuel's unpredictable and volatile behavior, Heather and John chose to keep their wedding location a secret.

693.831 - 697.276 Heather Grossman

That's how afraid I was of him.

698.778 - 704.445 Alan Johnson

Just four months later, while driving to a lunch date, Heather and John were gunned down.

Chapter 7: What evidence linked Ron Samuels to the shooting?

756.103 - 769.995 Alan Johnson

So you're suggesting that John Grossman staged this shooting. He was injured, though, in the shooting. He was shot. Doesn't make any sense to me. I don't think that was intentional.

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775.079 - 779.203 Troy Roberts

He shot somebody in a car twice with a rifle out the window.

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779.774 - 792.509 Alan Johnson

But the evidence the investigators were gathering told a very different story. It began with a great lead. A detailed description of the hitman's car.

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794.692 - 798.076 911 Operator

It's a teal-colored Thunderbird, a newer model.

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798.576 - 800.859 Alan Johnson

Including the license plate.

800.879 - 803.142 Troy Roberts

B-I-X-30-I.

804.503 - 816.91 Alan Johnson

The car was registered to an insurance salesman named Hugh Estes. At the time, Estes was a self-admitted crack addict.

816.93 - 825.077 Troy Roberts

I had a lot of money. I got hooked into cocaine and other drugs. And boy, it'll empty your wallet fast.

827.74 - 852.402 Alan Johnson

Investigators put the squeeze on Estes, who told them all about the plan. He coughed up the names of the two men in the T-Berg. A crack dealer and pimp named Eddie Slim Stafford was the driver. Another petty criminal, Roger Runyon, was the shooter. Still, another man, Jeff Pollack, was not involved in drugs, but was at meetings where Samuels allegedly discussed the murder plans.

Chapter 8: What was the outcome of the trial and how did Heather feel about it?

867.44 - 896.181 Alan Johnson

But who was paying? Ron Samuels gave the instructions to Hugh Estes and to Jeff Pollack. Assistant State Attorney Al Johnson. What were the instructions? Get me somebody to kill my ex-wife. Ron, did you hire these men to kill your ex-wife? Troy, I'm from Brooklyn, New York. If I wanted to pay somebody to do this,

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896.785 - 916.11 Alan Johnson

I'd have gone to New York and the professionals would have come there and no, I didn't wanna do that. And no, I did not pay anybody. Ronald Samuels was the puppet master. But could this bizarre conspiracy story hold up in court?

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916.671 - 945.158 Alan Johnson

Investigators had no direct evidence linking Samuels to the crime, but they believed he had a powerful motive, the costly custody fight that could see him lose his children, a fight Samuels was determined to win. Look, it's my clone. Say hi, Papa, I'm the clone. Hi, Papa, I'm the clone. What do the children mean to you? I was willing to swap my life for theirs.

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946.64 - 951.006 Alan Johnson

And he was willing to put his children right in the middle of the fight.

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951.586 - 953.128 911 Operator

Come on over here and let's just have a seat.

953.629 - 960.478 Alan Johnson

To document his claims that John Grossman was abusing the children, he had them examined by a psychologist.

961.019 - 966.506 911 Operator

If you've done something wrong at your house when you're at your mom, what happens?

966.526 - 975.182 Heather Grossman

I get spanked. And who does the spanking? It's usually John. and grandpa and grandma.

975.202 - 981.77 Alan Johnson

Little Ronnie was just six years old when he accused John Grossman and Heather's parents of harming him.

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