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Chapter 1: What sensitive topics are addressed in this episode?
The following podcast contains accounts of child sexual assault. Listener discretion is advised. Tara Brown, senior reporter for 60 Minutes, joins us to unpack the Epstein files. We focus on her documentary, The Reckoning Inside the Epstein Files, exploring the network and influence of Jeffrey Epstein, the experience of survivors and the fallout after his death.
That documentary is available on Nine Now and also on Stan. In exciting news for us, this interview will also air nationally on our brand new Kiss FM radio show. It's called True Crime Tonight and it's on every Sunday around Australia at 6pm. This is Australian True Crime.
We acknowledge the traditional owners of the land on which this podcast is created, the Wurundjeri Woi Wurrung people of the Kulin Nation.
I don't want to make it sound like it's an explainer, but in a way that's what it evolved into. We certainly couldn't cover everything that had been dumped in the Epstein files.
My daughter is saying to me, they killed children.
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Chapter 2: Who is Tara Brown and what is her connection to the Epstein files?
They killed babies. And I'm saying, darling, no, I don't believe that. But I think there is a feeling of things that we thought couldn't be true have turned out to be true.
Right now in New Mexico, following a tip, there's allegations that there were two young girls who died during violent sex on Epstein's ranch, and that's an allegation, so it is yet to be verified or even investigated properly. But sadly, as your daughter's identified,
Chapter 3: What insights does Tara Brown provide about Jeffrey Epstein's influence?
That is perhaps not far from the truth. In the past, you'd go, oh, that's ridiculous, and let's move on. And there is a lot of ridiculousness in this, I think. There are lots of extraordinarily outlandish allegations and tips, and that's part of the issue with the Epson files, working through that. But the fact that there is a sense of possibility is something kind of new.
if you can remove yourself in some way from the more crazy conspiracies, because the truth itself is terrible.
Is there any evidence that Geoffrey was offending before he and Ghislaine teamed up together? Do you think this could have happened without her?
That's a good question, Michelle, and I'd be lying if I knew the answer to that. I'm just trying to think of the dates because there's some suggestions that he was abusing girls as early as 1985.
And I know there's conjecture about when he and Ghislaine met. But I think that was before they met.
Yeah. And certainly the tendencies to sort of be inappropriate around young women was evidenced by people at the school that he taught at, Dalton, in New York City, an incredibly prestigious school. But the commentary from that was that he was ā He made people feel uncomfortable.
Look, I think that Jeffrey Epstein was very capable of assaulting young women, and he had a penchant for it, I think, well before Glenn Maxwell came on the scene, and he continued well after she left.
I think one of the pieces of information that's sort of floated to the top in the Epstein files being made public is the email in which Galen confirms that that photograph of Virginia and Prince Andrew and Galen taken in her house in London is legit. After years of claiming that it wasn't.
Oh, it was huge. And I think I was... kind of surprised and a bit disappointed that it didn't capture the headlines as I imagined it would. The dispute about the photograph captured the headlines. The former Prince Andrew was happy to call Virginia a liar. And so was Galette Maxwell from an interview in jail. She said she knew she was lying. What this photograph proved was that they were lying.
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Chapter 4: What are the shocking allegations surrounding Jeffrey Epstein's actions?
And, in fact, while that theory is being very popular today, There doesn't yet seem to be any evidence of that. Certainly a sex trafficking ring, yes, but in terms of blackmailing influential people, I don't know that you can say it didn't happen, but so far there's no evidence it did.
That's one of the theories around the Wexner money, isn't it? That somehow, through some scenario, he's extorted money out of Wexner, the founder of Victoria's Secret. Was Geoffrey stealing from him or was Wexner a co-conspirator? Was there an arrangement between them? How did so much of Wexner's money end up in Geoffrey's possession?
Well, I think it starts, again, it has parallels with how he was able to sexually abuse so many young people. Because I think the relationship with Les Wexner to begin with was one of... trust and friendship. Jeffrey Epstein sold himself as a financial whiz. He was the only guy who knew what was going on.
He could find all those missing assets that your other advisors have lost, that he could bring something new. I think as a businessman, Les Wexner was very attracted to that and And again, Jeffrey Epstein was very good at selling himself, and so we have a situation where Epstein becomes pretty much Les Wexner's sole financial advisor.
is given power of attorney, which means that he can make lots of financial decisions on Les Wexner's part. Now, in 2019, Les Wexner claims that he was tricked by Jeffrey Epstein, that he'd been lied to, that Epstein had stolen lots of money from him, and that it was a terrible mistake.
But we've also learned from the Epstein files that Liz Wexner had been named as a co-conspirator by the FBI and the Department of Justice. What we don't know is why that went nowhere.
You introduced us to a fellow I was not expecting, a Republican congressman from Kentucky, who seems to be the spearhead of the fight to keep the files in the news, to actually bring about some real resolution to this situation. Tell us about him.
Yes. So Thomas Massey is the co-author of the Epstein Transparency Act. And so effectively, he and a Democrat congressman made sure that these Epstein files were released. And that's what the Act essentially and in a very simple way does. So he was saying, there are all these files and they need to be released. It was a promise made by Donald Trump to do so.
And Thomas Massey has made sure and is fighting for them to be released. And really bringing to account the Department of Justice for basically hiding the names of potential co-conspirators and revealing the names of many of the survivors who wish to remain anonymous.
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