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Chapter 1: What does James Dolan reveal about his public speaking?
all right welcome back to the carton show chris mcmonagle craig carton and uh thrilled to have a dear friend of mine joining us in studio and i didn't realize till last night reading the new york post that james zone hasn't spoken publicly since he joined me and evan roberts three years ago and now he's back happy new year thank you for joining us happy new year this is my biannual confession
Is it that nobody asks you to speak? That's it.
I want to speak all the time, but nobody ever asks me.
It's like the pretty girl at the bar. No one ever asks me outside. None of any dates. That kind of thing. Or maybe not. Or maybe not. There's a lot to talk to you since I guess you haven't spoken of a lot of your Knicks and Rangers issues in the last few years. Let me start with the Knicks. Obviously, the great run last year. Looks like they're on their way to a special season this year.
But in the process, you also made a decision, you and Leon Rose, to relieve Tom Thibodeau of his head coaching duties. And Mike comes in, has done a really nice job thus far. Can you walk us through what the thinking was at the time you made it?
If it was just Leon coming to you saying, we need a change, if you guys collectively thought the team needed a different voice in the locker room, and what was the genesis of moving on from Tom?
Well, look, you know, Leon and I talk about everything, even not basketball stuff. Got it. But, you know, The team is really built on the shoulders of Tom Thibodeau. He built that core. We went as far as we did last year. And so you really got to take your hat off to Tom and the job that he did. But we did come to the conclusion that we had an idea of how we wanted to organize the team.
And actually, it goes for both teams. And And that meant we needed to evolve, actually beyond the old traditional coaching formulas, etc. And we tried to work that with Tom. It really wasn't his thing.
I don't want to put words in your mouth. Do you mean like not using the bench that much, the style of play?
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Chapter 2: What are the current issues with the Knicks?
Right, and that's important for the development of a franchise. And that really, you know, Tom liked development, but he didn't really...
Well, he's the guy that, you know, he likes playing the veterans. He likes playing the guys that, you know, buy into his system. And guys like that, he has throughout his career have a shelf life, right? And he got to an Eastern Conference final.
You guys collectively had to have felt that while the run was great, and he gets a lot of credit for being a part of the Nick turnaround, that you couldn't win a title with him.
Chapter 3: How does Dolan justify the coaching change for the Knicks?
That had to be the thinking. Right?
Or be unlikely that you would. I won't say you can't win a title with Tom Thibodeau. I don't necessarily know that's true. It's just that if you want to build a long-term competitive, compete for the, you know.
You needed a different guy.
You need somebody who's much more of a collaborator than Tom was. But still, Tom is still a great coach. He should coach again in the NBA. If I had a franchise that I was just starting with, et cetera, he would be a goldmine to get. And he was like that for us. When we first started and he first came in, he brought discipline. He brought strategy.
He was the right guy at the time.
Right. He was right. He brought us all that way. But we really felt we needed to make a change to go the rest of the way.
Now, did you go to Tom and discuss these changes, or did you just take his?
No, we decided to surprise him.
Well, I'm saying, like, because you mentioned it wasn't his thing. Was there discussions about possibly getting him to changes, and it felt like it wasn't going to happen, or did you just make the assumption Tom wasn't the kind of coach you could make the changes you were looking for?
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Chapter 4: What is the future vision for the Knicks and their development strategy?
Right. And I was like, OK.
They did too well.
I thought, you know, this is going to be amazing. great preview. But maybe that was the preview.
Spurs beat them three straight?
Is Nick Spurs? I don't know. But, you know, to get a chance at midseason, right, to try out what you're going to be like at the end of the season. So you liked it. It was exciting. And I was very proud of the guys that did a great job. And so we're proud to have the Emirates Cup. But we're going to hang a championship.
A real banner.
A real banner.
A couple more Nick questions, and we'll get to the Rangers here in a second. Is Leon long-term committed? Do we have to worry as Nick fans that Leon Rose wakes up after this season and says, I had a good run, went to the Eastern Conference Final, maybe win an NBA championship? Or is he locked into you guys long-term? Because he's the only GM that never talks.
Yeah, we don't hear from him. Yeah, well, I mean, theā You have to ask Leon, but Leon doesn't answer questions. That's right. He's cut from the same cloth that I am. As far as I know, Leon's on with us for the long term. We don't ever talk about an end to this. We have a five-year plan. Right now, we're actually on more like a two- to three-year plan.
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Chapter 5: What are the Jets' plans for Aaron Glenn and Darren Muji moving forward?
Darren Muji is still the general manager. He's making the draft picks. But the final say and the main voice of the deciding factor, if it's a 50-50 vote, it's going to be Aaron Glenn. That's the case when you hire somebody like Harbaugh. He becomes the extra vote. His voice carries more weight when you're somebody who is of his stature and has accomplished what he's accomplished.
You brought up the J word, the Jets. Yeah. I am a supporter of Aaron Glenn coming back for a second season. But when John Harbaugh became available, my thought was this is the guy we were waiting for. This is the culture changer. This is everything the Jet fan has dreamt of, really, since Rex was gone.
Chapter 6: What are the implications of hiring John Harbaugh for the Jets?
Like, this is the guy that can change everything. Yep. Is Woody Johnson at all using any back channels to just get a sense if John Harbaugh would have interest in being the savior for the New York Jets? Look, if Woody's making his own calls and sending his own texts and telling nobody, I mean, look, back in week two, was it?
I mean, or before, I'm sorry, not week two, but I found out about it week two. Before Micah Parsons was traded, it was Woody and Jerry had a conversation about trading for Parsons.
Chapter 7: How do the Giants' coaching decisions impact their future?
So, I mean, I don't have Woody's phone. I have no idea if he sent a text or called somebody just off doing his own thing.
but I can tell you that I looked into this yesterday, and I did some digging on it, and what I was told was that the Jets have no interest, basically, in Harbaugh, that they are fully and completely committed to Aaron Glenn and Darren Muji, and they're moving forward with Aaron Glenn and Darren Muji, and they're very excited for the 2026 season. They're not pursuing Harbaugh.
They're not doing what the Dolphins are doing right now with Mike McDaniel under contract. It's nothing like that. They are committed to Aaron Glenn, and look, Evan, I agree with you. I mean, it's funny because, And last year's coaching cycle, there were two names out there that were pretty much the no-doubt bona fide, these guys are as slam-dunk hires as you can possibly imagine.
Chapter 8: What are the potential changes in the MLB landscape discussed?
And it was the guy who's been there and done that, and it was Mike Vrabel. And on the coordinating ranks, it was Ben Johnson. Those are the two guys that were like, oh, A+, A++ hires. This cycle, there wasn't that guy. So the Jets can kind of always fall back on like, well, it's not like, you know, we hired Aaron and we're not, well, look who else did we get that's better?
Harbaugh is the domino that fell that changed everything because Harbaugh is now on that Vrabel level. You know what I mean? He is that type of a guy. But no, the Jets are completely and totally committed to Aaron Glenn. I guess that's noble of them, but I would be seedier than that. That's just me.
I mean, because no offense to Glenn, because I've been fighting with Jet fans about keeping him for a second season, but this feels like a game changer. It feels like this is where I would pivot off of that, and it doesn't feel like the Jets feel the same way, which is... See, here's the thing, though. There's just so many other things that would need to happen before.
Again, this is not reporting or sourcing, but this hypothetical world where Harbaugh becomes the Jets coach, there's so many things that need to happen because the Jets can't just fire Aaron Glenn and hire Harbaugh. They would have to fire Aaron Glenn, then go through the same interview process of doing the Rooney rule and interviewing these guys and doing that.
There's also no guarantee that something doesn't happen last second where, hey, say the Giants come in with $10 million more a year hypothetically to get Harbaugh, and suddenly Harbaugh's like, yeah, you know what? I did want the Jets, but now I don't. It's not this Madden game where it's just, oh, there's Harbaugh, let me fire this coach and hire the next one.
There's so much that needs to happen there that it's it would be such a risk and potentially have so much blowback on their face of badness that it makes sense why they're moving forward for at least this year with Aaron Glenn.
Now, Connor, you referenced that process that you would go through, and obviously the Giants are going through that process right now. So when it comes to flying Kevin Stefanski in and he meets and has dinner with the Giants right away, How much of a game of, like, chance do you think the Giants are playing here? Meeting with Stefanski right away, going through a couple of interviews.
If Harbaugh wants to wait this out two weeks, weigh all the options. Do you think there's a scenario where the Giants can completely fumble this and Stefanski says, forget this, I'm taking the Falcon job, and they lose out on Harbaugh and him?
I don't think they lose out on both, no. Personally, I don't think they lose out on both those guys. I think they'll probably have either Harbaugh or Stefanski as their head coach. I do. And the difference here from other head coaching circles or other head coaching cycles that I've covered is that the Giants are the best option out there.
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