Is our tax money being spent well?
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What is the main topic discussed in this episode?
The Clare Byrne Show on Newstalk. With Aviva Insurance.
The Irish state collected €106 billion in taxes last year. Not €106 million, €106 billion. And we've heard recently about the half a billion euro earned in fuel taxes that had yet to be spent. Only yesterday we heard about the bumper carbon tax revenue that will be collected this year. So the big question we're asking today is, is our tax money being well spent? And I'm joined in the studio by Albert Dolan, who is Fianna Fáil TD for Galway East and on the line by Dan O'Brien, Chief Economist with the Institute of International and European Affairs and columnist with The Currency. And you're both welcome to the programme.
What is the total amount of tax collected by the Irish state?
Albert, I'm going to begin with you because you've taken on this project where you're trying to show people exactly how the money is being spent. Tell me how that works.
Yeah, so essentially over the last two years, Clare, I've recognised that the spend in this country, and as you highlighted there, there's a huge amount of money coming in, but the spend is increasing at a rapid rate. And when your spend is increasing as a country at such a rate, you can be sure that... The government wants to spend money, but how can you ensure that it's being spent properly, spent efficiently and spent effectively? So we said, well, what gets tracked gets managed. So we set up, myself and Matthew Fenlon, set up the public spend tracker. And essentially what it does is all of the information that's available on state websites, on state entity websites, we've pulled all of that data together.
What is the significance of the half a billion euro in fuel taxes?
And just in the last week, we've crossed 100 billion euros worth of spend tracking since the state started publishing purchase orders online. So we're primarily focused on procurement spend. And for anyone listening, procurement spend basically means when the state can't do something itself, it goes out and gets somebody else to do it and we pay them, i.e., building a school or, you know, hiring in advisors or hiring consultants or something like that. That's what public procurement spending is. We've tracked 100 billion of it and we're going to use that information to force efficiencies and to bring clarity.
That's key that you say force efficiencies. So you've come at this from a place where you believe the system is not efficient, that there isn't accountability and that there is wastage.
Yeah, well, I think the biggest frustration for somebody listening at home who's working hard paying tax, the biggest frustration for them is to see money not being spent what they would believe properly. And you have a two-tier system here. You have a civil service who is adamant about following process and making sure that the process is followed. And then you have the public and the public want to ensure that they are getting value for money. And the questions that the public would ask themselves is, why? Would it have cost me this much if I was to do it? And did it need to be done? And that is where the frustration is coming, is that there can be needless spending and that there can be spending that doesn't make sense.
And I think that's why when you talk about the likes of the bike sheds, that really hits home with people.
And I see that you've written a Substack article about this and you have juxtaposed those two questions that the public would say, is this value for money? The civil servant will say, did I follow the processes? Now, they are wildly apart, aren't they? They're completely different questions.
Yeah, and that's why it's so important that us as public representatives, you know, the one thing I will say about the work we've been doing over the last year, we wrote to over 200 state entities. And as a result, you know, the Children's Hospital, wasn't publishing their spend data online. We got them to do that. The TII was spending billions, not publishing it online. So who was looking at this over the last few years? I'm on the Public Accounts Committee. We look at the accounts, we look at the audit report, but we don't get into the nitty gritty of auditing.
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Chapters
6 chapters
1
What is the main topic discussed in this episode?
0:01–0:46
2
What is the total amount of tax collected by the Irish state?
0:46–1:39
3
What is the significance of the half a billion euro in fuel taxes?
1:39–3:48
4
How is public spending tracked in Ireland?
3:48–11:50
5
What challenges are faced in ensuring proper spending of tax money?
11:50–12:08
6
What frustrations do taxpayers have regarding government spending?
12:08–15:59
Speakers
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