My guest is Dr. Karolina Westlund, Ph.D., a professor of ethology at the University of Stockholm and an expert in animal emotions and behavior who uses science-based methods to improve the lives of animals in human care. We discuss the often overlooked needs of domesticated animals—primarily dogs and cats—and the things we can do to improve their well-being and our relationship with them. We cover how to interpret animal body language, the unique needs of specific dog breeds, and the needs of cats and birds. We also discuss the pros and cons of spaying and neutering and how weaning age impacts a pet’s attachment style. Whether you’re a pet owner, trainer, or simply an animal lover, this episode teaches you how specific pet behaviors are rooted in their immutable biology—and the simple things you can do to vastly improve your pets’ health and well-being, as well as your relationship with them. Read the episode show notes at hubermanlab.com. Thank you to our sponsors AG1: https://drinkag1.com.huberman Our Place: https://fromourplace.com/huberman Eight Sleep: https://eightsleep.com/huberman Joovv: https://joovv.com/huberman Function: https://functionhealth.com/huberman Timestamps 00:00:00 Karolina Westlund 00:02:19 Students & Animal Species; Horses 00:06:36 Dog Breeds & Interaction, Predatory Sequence, Smell, Domestication 00:12:42 Sponsors: Our Place & Eight Sleep 00:16:09 Dog Breeds & Domestication, Bulldogs 00:20:16 Core Affect Space, Petting, Tool: Consent Test; Polyvagal Theory 00:27:53 Space, Dominance, Resources, Leash Walking; Dog-Owner Training 00:37:13 Tail Wagging & Interpreting Body Signals, Facial Expressions 00:43:24 Play Bow, Tool: MARS & Playing; Dogs & Empathy 00:48:39 Sponsors: AG1 & Joovv 00:51:46 Fairness, Social Groups; Anthropomorphism vs Anthropodenial 00:57:45 Cats, Hunting, Bring Gifts?, Interaction & Socialization 01:03:56 Scent & Territorial Marking; Covering Waste, Tool: Litter Box Placement 01:08:17 “Pee Mail” & Communication; Wolves, Domestication 01:11:54 Zoos, Conservation; Tigers 01:18:53 Sponsor: Function 01:20:41 Stalking; Birds, Parrots 01:25:22 Nose Work, Wildlife Chasing, Tool: Dog Feeding & Challenge 01:31:01 Understanding & Choosing Dog for Your Lifestyle, Tool: Introducing Cats 01:34:27 Recognizing Self vs Other, Inbreeding Avoidance, Imprinting 01:40:51 Imprinting vs Attachment Bonds; Dogs, Weaning & Secure Attachment 01:48:36 Spaying & Neutering, Hormones, Tool: Neutering Alternatives 01:57:07 Humans as Animals, Tools, Cultural Learning 02:02:47 Zero-Cost Support, YouTube, Spotify & Apple Follow & Reviews, Sponsors, YouTube Feedback, Protocols Book, Social Media, Neural Network Newsletter Disclaimer & Disclosures Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
Full Episode
Welcome to the Huberman Lab Podcast, where we discuss science and science-based tools for everyday life. I'm Andrew Huberman, and I'm a professor of neurobiology and ophthalmology at Stanford School of Medicine. My guest today is Dr. Carolina Westland. Dr. Carolina Westland is an animal ethologist and expert in animal behavior.
Dr. Westland and I discuss the relationship between humans and domesticated animals with a focus on the evidence-based protocols for optimizing the mental and physical health of our pets. Dr. Westland explains the best way to interact with our animals. Now, we may assume that the way we pet our animals and exercise them and feed them makes them truly happy.
But as she points out, many of the things that people assume turn out to be false when it comes to our pets and their fundamental drives. She teaches us the very basic but powerful things that we can do to satisfy those drives, both for the animal's sake, of course, and to better our relationship with them.
We also discuss the unique neurological and physiological requirements of different dog breeds. That's a fascinating conversation that stems from their lineage from wolves. And we'll tell you whether or not your particular breed, even if it's a mutt, should be exercised in a particular way, whether or not it needs additional forms of stimulation that you're not currently giving it and so on.
And because we both realize there are also cat owners out there, too, we discuss the often misunderstood communication signals and social needs of cats. As you may know, there is a tremendous amount of debate out there about the best training and practices for taking care of our dogs and other animals.
And so much of that is grounded in speculation and training outcomes, which of course are important. The conversation today with Dr. Westland approaches animal health and welfare through the lens of ethology and the species that our pets evolved from to provide actionable protocols that are grounded in science and that you can implement right away to improve your pet's wellbeing.
So if you're a pet owner, This episode is going to be of immense value to you. If you're not a pet owner, you'll still learn a ton about animal biology and psychology, including yours. Before we begin, I'd like to emphasize that this podcast is separate from my teaching and research roles at Stanford.
It is, however, part of my desire and effort to bring zero cost to consumer information about science and science-related tools to the general public. In keeping with that theme, this episode does include sponsors. And now for my discussion with Dr. Carolina Westland. Dr. Carolina Westland, welcome. Thank you. I'm super excited for this conversation.
Yeah, me too.
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