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Chapter 1: What is the main topic discussed in this episode?
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Welcome back. You are listening to another episode of KeepTheChange.co.nz's Muddy Mail. It is always good to have you tuning in, and I hope you are hissing for the FIFA World Cup, a big old tournament internationally. By the time you listen to this, I will be there, which is very, very exciting, and I'll be floating around America.
So anyway, stay tuned to the Instagram channel, even YouTube if you don't follow KeepTheChange over on YouTube. I put out a lot of different content over there. and some short form stuff. But I'll try and do a little bit whilst I am away. But at the minute, I am doing a bit of pre-recording so that I can ensure that the content keeps going out.
And the beautiful thing about once you do things a number of times, you can start to build processes and systems to put things through. So I'll record these and then it goes into the system of going out at the same time. But you've still got to do the work. Everyone's talking about AI these days and how much AI can do.
But I think at the core of it, we've still got to do the fundamental piece of the work, and then hopefully AI can support making these things go a bit faster. But the reason I raise that, I've just listened before it goes out to the AI podcast that Mikey and I recorded a little while ago, but it's going out. And it's a really grunty listen. I think it's about an hour 20.
I'd really encourage you to listen to the whole thing. It's just him and I kicking the shit, kind of trying to figure out what could happen with AI, but a couple of things we're already spotting about it. Also yesterday, I recorded a podcast with Al. and he is a jazz and music teacher and he approached me to do a paid consult.
I don't do a lot of them but I slot in, I might do like one a month and it's basically people who ask me a question and I actually need to get in and figure it out and I can't do that flippantly over the internet or over a message and I say well hey if you want me to take a look at this I'll do that and it's 500 bucks plus GST.
And typically nine, I'd say 19 out of 20 people, well then they don't commit because they don't actually want to risk spending the money investing in themselves because they're not there yet. They're just looking for a quick answer. So anyway, Al was ready to pay and he was like, can we do this? And I thought, well,
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Chapter 2: Why is the belief of not living to 65 considered dangerous?
Actually, he wanted to know about scaling up his side hustle and how I would approach it. And I thought, you know what, this could be really valuable for you guys. So I sat down and did about an hour 50 in the studio with him and recorded as a pod, so I didn't make him pay. And Hopefully other people can learn from that.
And now I'll be able to send that piece of content to people who ask that in the future. But I ended up going a bit deeper than I normally would with just different principles and trying to weave in different examples. There's probably a whole heap of stuff that I missed as well. But the good thing is that Al will go away and take action. I know that he will.
We can just tell he's that sort of dude, especially if he was willing to pay the money to have the call to start with. So in three months, we'll get him back, or maybe even six and just see where he's got to. But I think three months will be more than enough. And I'm going to check in with him along the way as well. I think there'll be some big wins for that lad in his future.
And it's not for me to tell him how to do it, but it's for... me to help show some of the things that I'm seeing that are working and then he can pick his path and go and test some things.
I'm always doing the same thing, test and learn, test and learn and same thing for him and we'll get to find out, okay, what's working, what did he like, what didn't he like and then we get to rehash it out for maybe an hour and then maybe do that again three months, six months and into the future as well.
So it should be a good series of content for people to learn from because I know a lot of you thinking about scaling up your side hustle or you get to a point where you can't scale your business further, you're trying to figure out leverage or even you're just trying to get started and you might want to see what problems are going to be coming for you down the pipe.
So yeah, I think it would be one of the most valuable pieces of content that I would have recorded in the last little while and I really hope that it helps a lot of you and I think I'll get paid back for it in good karma and probably future clients and future work and stuff into the future and that's an example of me investing into
the audience knowing that it'll come back around, you know, and doing the same thing on Friday. I was down at Wellington College speaking, took a videographer, going to film that one. That can go up. There's some other content and stuff. Got to pay to do all of that. I do that presentation pro bono. It's the one that I do a year for a school.
That's the only school that I do apart from Palmy Boys if they were to ask because I've got enough, I've got so much other shit going on and I don't want to then have another school ask me, then another school and another school. And I just, yeah, it's not fair on the other priorities that I have in my life. So I can't go down that route yet. I'm not in that position.
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Chapter 3: How do beliefs shape our financial behaviors?
And they went on to say, I think it's just education. Everyone has their KiwiSaver with the bank or whoever was their default. I've been on to them about changing it, but the usual answer is, I don't think I'll be alive at 65 anyway. So because they don't think they'll be alive at 65, they're not going to engage in chat about KiwiSaver and those types of things, right? Why would you?
And
This is really dangerous because I've come to learn that beliefs shape behavior and our actions. If you truly believe you won't have a future, why would you prepare for one? And that's basically what this person is learning from moving from city to another city and getting into a different environment. Why would you invest? Why would you look after your health? Why would you build discipline?
Why would you delay gratification? Why would you think longer term? Why would you create stability? Why would you take ownership? Maybe that sneaky belief gives us the permission to avoid responsibility for our future self. So what I'm saying there is, are we using that belief as a way to not take responsibility?
I think for a percentage of these people that believe that they won't make it to 65 and that that will be why they're doing it, to validate for themselves that they don't need to because they don't really want to take responsibility because it's hard, right? Above the line thinking, ownership, accountability, responsibility. Rather, blame, excuse, deny, below the line. What's easier?
Well, I won't make it. That'll never be me. Therefore, I never have to prepare for it. So then we don't take actions that are going to help us. We take actions in alignment with our belief. Our belief is we won't make it to 65. Then we don't have to take some of the...
Frustrating actions like looking after ourself, being disciplined and delaying gratification, not spending everything, saving, building up options, that sort of thing. So instead, we back up our belief and we take ownership of that with, well, I can live for the now and YOLO and all this other sort of shit. But what if it's not true is the first point, right?
But what if it's not true that you won't make it to 65? That's, I guess, the first question. And the problem becomes for these people if you say to them, well, what's the statistics on this? Because everybody knows someone that's died before 65, right? So that's the data that they have. But in New Zealand, the average life expectancy is around the low 80s. And for women, it's older.
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Chapter 4: What impact does environment have on financial beliefs?
Most people reading this have a very high chance of making it past 65. So this is just our first baseline data point. Now I know a lot of people straight away will be like, yes, but we have different cultures in New Zealand and everybody has different life expectancies. And, you know, therefore this problem could be or this belief may be more prominent in different regions. Hey, I get that.
And I read the same data. But isn't that then why it's more important that if their belief is taking them the wrong way and they get there and they're less prepared because we haven't interrupted them and said, hey, that might not be true for you. Be very careful, but isn't that why it's more important? Not, oh, this is missing the point. Māori people do die younger.
Well, I come from a Māori background as well, but my dad, he didn't raise us to go, fuck, you guys might not make it to 65. And I don't think he thinks like that, and he has made it to 65. So you've got to be really careful, I think, with using the difference in statistics to back up inaction.
If anything, you want to go, okay, well, yes, hopefully someone can help solve some of the other issues around that, but... It doesn't mean that every single person will die at 65 because they're Māori or live in a different region, et cetera. So we need to educate them that that may not be what happens and they may not be that statistic.
So of course, none of us really know when we're going to die and how life will play out for us, when we might get sick or a partner may, any of that stuff. We don't really know. But by believing that the worst will happen for you, you're choosing to gamble on that being your future and therefore the decisions that you're going to make leading up to that.
So if you do make it to 65 without assets, without savings, without options, life can become incredibly difficult. Now, my second perspective on this is that even if you don't genuinely care about becoming wealthy or prepared for your future or sorted at 65, you know, we got sorted as a slogan, sorted.gov.nz sort of thing. If that's not your mantra... Why not build something that outlives you?
And one of the things that I'm often trying to encourage you to do is to think bigger than just yourself. And this, I think, is a great concept to embed into different areas of your life. I was at Wellington College on Friday, right? And I walk out to head back to the airport. And there was two lads. I don't know why they weren't in class. And there was a piece of rubbish on the ground.
I said, hey, lads, you probably want to pick that piece of rubbish up that you're standing by. And they're looking on the ground. I can't see it. I'm like, it's right there next to that pole. And the young lad turned to me, he's like, that's not my rubbish though. I'm like, that's not the point though. Pick it up and put it in the bin, man. And he did.
But the first response is, that's not my rubbish. Well... okay, he's right. That's not his rubbish, but it's still his school and he can choose whether it becomes his responsibility and he can choose what his response to me is, someone who's older than him saying or suggesting it'd be a smarter idea to keep the school looking clean and to put that piece of rubbish into the bin. Now,
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Chapter 5: How can we challenge destructive beliefs about the future?
So she wanted to live her life based on that belief that nobody would have to cover the cost of that and that she'd be able to provide for it. Now, she probably underestimated what a funeral ends up costing, but that's something that I learned. I'm like, wow, that's quite cool. She didn't really want for much order, store up heaps of things.
And she was very selfless, I think that's the right word, and was an amazing person. And she carried herself with this, like, I don't want to leave somebody else with the cost of that. So I sort of learned that and gone, hmm, that's quite cool. How can we individually think, well, why do we just think about ourselves at times? You know, why can't we think a bit bigger?
So your future investments could help your kids, your nieces, your nephews, your siblings, your community, your sports club, or causes that you care about. Because, yo, you might not make it to 65, but your nieces, your kids, your nephews, your siblings, your community, your sports clubs, they might. There's heaps of those people with data to suggest that they do.
So instead of just thinking about yourself, why not think a bit bigger? Why not think a bit wider? Why not have a bit more purpose to it? And that gives yourself a bigger reason than just yourself. And I think it's an amazing principle that's really hard to embed. But if you can pull yourself up at times and go, okay, why don't I think a little bit wider here? then how would I act?
It's a bit the same for me. When I look, I'm like, shit, I probably should take Rit, my videographer, down for the day to Wellington. I'll capture this conversation. I'm going to have to pay for some flights. I'm going to have to pay to have it all edited and all that sort of stuff. But my first reaction is, ah, shit. I've left it to the last day. The flights are expensive.
It's going to be like $800 for flights. And I'm like, well, it's probably still the right thing to do because I can invest the money that I've got sitting there into doing this and something good will come of it in the future.
Now, the other part of me is like, bro, just invest that money into something that's going to grow with a capital gain and then you don't even need to do the work to make that money and you don't have to pay tax on it. Whereas if I get ripped to go down, I've got to use my money. I've got to spend it.
And then I've got to then go do the work to monetize the opportunity that comes of it in the future to then pay another 40% tax on it to then have it. So you can see like why people took the easy route for many decades going, fuck, why would I work and do more work to then be taxed on it when I could just invest in property, get a capital gain and not pay any tax on it?
You know, which let's be real, like humans are naturally quite lazy. So which path would you rather take? You know, decision making, why as well going, one's the right thing to do. The other is the easy way. Which path's better, the right way or the easy way?
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Chapter 6: What lessons can we learn from personal experiences with aging?
Yet a million people are like, I might use buy now, pay later to buy shit that I can't afford right now. and get my future self to pay it off. But on the other part of me, I'm worried about losing my job to AI. Make that make sense. Shouldn't we be retracting back into ourselves not buying shit?
You know, not buying the fifth Warriors jersey that they've released for this season going, you know what, I probably should put that 200 bucks aside. Sorry, Cameron George. But you know what I mean? We're not doing that. People are saying one thing and on the other, they are not putting money aside to give themselves options for the future. So it's easy to talk about these things.
It's harder to do it when the marketing machine is pounding us and taking the money from us. But all that you're doing when you're stacking up some savings for the future is storing your energy, storing choices, and storing options. It's not just about retirement. It's about creating choices and reducing future pressure for both yourself and the people around you.
And I'm absolutely loving recording this, to be honest, because recently I've had a number of people messaging me saying, shit, the Keep the Change podcast changed my life. I'm like, tell me what you mean by that. And just about every time, it's like my mindset around money. And I think what they're saying is this sort of shit. I'm challenging beliefs of ways that they're looking at things.
Like, yeah, why the fuck am I telling myself not to save, that I'm going to die before I'm 65? Right? Like, where did that come from, you know? And even just like that AI thing that I explained there, like, no one's talking about that. But now that I've planted that, you're like, yeah, shit, okay. That's a good point.
You know, maybe if I'm worried about my income going, and even, you know, if I was working in construction, especially in the North Island at the moment, sheesh, I'd want to have like some dollar roos stacked aside because there's still some liquidation and some carnage going to come down the pipe. with some businesses that aren't going to make it through.
And, you know, you might be on a good salary and not stacking much aside now going, I don't really need to, I'm in with a great company. You just don't know, but you're not storing options, choices and safety in the future. You're using your money as energy to let go, to have the things that you want in the here and now.
So some of us still listening are going to get a bit of a rude shock as to some of the things that may play out in this economy. So just be a bit careful, you know, Now, as I said before, some people say to me as well, you know, I'm purposely going to die with zero dollars or debt. Like they're going to die in debt so the debt's somebody else's problem or have nothing the day that they die.
And, you know, I kind of get that, right? Decumulation, to a degree, there's I think some fairness to it. You know, stack your assets and then use them on the decumulation and enjoy your life, that sort of thing. But again, this is what I was saying about my nana, you know, her desire was to not leave other people in debt. and not have to tidy things up.
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Chapter 7: How can thinking beyond oneself influence financial decisions?
Yes, they may be hard and a lot different, but they matter. Now, lastly on this, preparing for the future via investing or storing options, again, it doesn't mean that you need to become obsessed with money, but you do need to challenge destructive beliefs because one day your future arrives, whether you're prepared for it or not.
So would you rather die before 65 with your financial affairs in order, or would you rather die before 65 without them in order? Would you rather get to 65 and realize that you did, your beliefs were wrong, and now your financial affairs aren't in order? Because statistically speaking, many of the people who believe that they won't make it to 65, they could be wrong.
So you've got to be careful of these people if they're rolling around telling you stuff like that. Try and support them and educate them because they need a small helping hand from you and a nudge in the right direction. Now, going back to the top, before you at me with the example of somebody who was accumulating and then they did die before 65, I've seen heaps of that too.
I had a business owner acquaintance who died recently and he was pretty stacked and he was fit and he was stacking a great life for himself and had some good financial resources already and bang, gone. So I'm not naive to this, but I think for us to foolishly and blindly think that we might not make it to 65... Shit, that could be very damaging.
And if you do, who are you then placing the responsibility onto? So be very careful with a belief like that. And before I get the ads or whatever when I put this content out, my stepdad, he didn't make it to 65. So I've seen this in my own family. But I never used his death as a, oh, fuck, no point for me preparing for 65. I'm not going to make it.
Like that was not the data point that I took from his death or his funeral, you know? So be careful what you let be your data point. And I've got many family members who have made it to 65 as well. I have many friends whose parents are getting to 65 and things are starting to get a bit shaky. And now we're having these tricky conversations over a beer, like far out. How does that work from there?
Like, how does it play out? I was speaking to a lady in the sauna recently, and she was telling me about her parents both going into homes and how hard that had been. She's like, man, not enough Kiwi people are talking about a plan for their parents. We all talk about what happens when we die, but what about the period before that?
What about when something happens and they're not quite as capable as they used to be? What's that plan? And why aren't we talking about that? I'm like, man, that's a pretty good point. Maybe I need to find some people that are good at talking about that and have got some experience in that space to do some pods to get us thinking about it. Because I think we do.
We have these milestones in New Zealand like paying off your house or getting to 65 and getting the pension or what happens when you die. Or what happens when you do go into the rest home? But what if you don't fit into those buckets? What if other things happen?
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Chapter 8: What are the consequences of not preparing for the future?
And so when sometimes people criticize me for, why are you talking to Dave Wood? It's about stress. It's not even about money. Well, if you can't handle your stress, how are you going to deal with that situation when that comes? Who's going to be the person in the family that has to stand up and sort it? What if you're an only child?
You're probably going to be the one that's going to have to do it. What if your stress tolerance isn't there, your resilience isn't there? Yeah, you'll find a way on adrenaline for so long, but bang, then you're going to get in trouble on the other side of it. So all of these things, I think, become incredibly important. And for us to
like naively push our responsibility onto other people or a version of us at 65 that we thought wasn't going to be alive anyway and then go, okay, champion, now you try and figure it out. Sheesh, we're just robbing ourselves of the opportunity of trying to sort it out earlier.
So I know this has been like a little bit full on and a bit of a kick up the ass, but know that it comes from a good place and just be really careful with the beliefs about money that you put into your brain. And lastly, And the top, I started with data, you know, of the average age, right? But even I think I tried to research, you know, how many people die before 65.
And I think it's maybe one in five of us. Now, that sounds like a lot. But statistically, and I don't know if that's accurate as well. So I haven't fact-checked that. And I'm sure health.org or somewhere, someone must have that data. And I'm sure it's changing over time, right? But aren't we being told we're going to live longer? And then we're saying, I don't know if I'll make it to 65.
And then data's telling us four or five of us will. Shit. What a fucking gamble to take. That we won't, based off seeing a couple of people in our lifetime that didn't. And then are we self-fulfilling that by doing things to our body and making choices and taking risks and taking actions that are going to increase our likelihood that we won't make it to 65? No.
Interesting, interesting, interesting, interesting thing to ponder. Be very careful of the things that you've believed without going and researching the data as to how true they could actually be. Be good. Love you guys. Want to see you win. Want to see you make better choices and slowly remove some of these things that could be so harmful to the actions that you decide. See you next week.
I'm living the life of the fear. I ain't looking up over my shoulders because I know that ain't nobody there. Ain't no plot twist on this bullshit, boy, straight to the fade around here. And I am not one of these gangsters, but I'm a thugger to mama, I swear. Give me my chips. I need my due diligence. Been in this bitch for years. Or I might just pull up to your crib.
I have a goal to help 100,000 Kiwis improve their financial literacy. Generate KiwiSaver scheme has sponsored Keep the Change to help me reach more people and make this a reality. Cheers to Generate. Head to generatekiwisaver.co.nz forward slash change to find out more.
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