Chapter 1: What is the definition of trust according to Dr. Stickel?
Trust is the willingness to be vulnerable when we can't completely predict how someone else is going to behave. And so for me, it means uncertainty times vulnerability gives us a level of perceived risk. And we each have a threshold of risk that we can tolerate.
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Ladies and gentlemen, welcome back for another powerful episode of Make Unplugged. And today's guest is the man that I call the architect of trust, building bridges where walls once stood. From global corporations to conflict zones, his work unlocks the human code behind true modern leadership. He's insightful. He's grounded. He's transformational. He is the good doctor, Dr. Daryl Sticker.
Dr. Daryl, how are you doing today, bro?
Brother, I really appreciate you having me on the podcast and I'm looking forward to spending some time together.
I appreciate you being here. You know, off top, we have to let the viewers and listeners understand this. We kind of don't like each other, Dr. Darrell. You know, I'm a UNC grad and you went to that school that starts with D in Durham, North Carolina that I can't pronounce very well. Right. How did we get here?
Right.
Well, the cream always rises, is what I would suggest. And we may not like each other, but I think given time, we'd come to love each other.
No, absolutely. Absolutely. As you know this, right? And I think most people understand this. Duke and UNC do have a love-hate relationship, right? A lot of hate, but it's a bunch of mutual respect, right? Like, take sports out of it. You have graduates of Duke, graduates of UNC. We always like to rib each other, right? But there's so much mutual respect.
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Chapter 2: How does vulnerability relate to trust in leadership?
Like when it comes to sports, no one can hate UNC more than you can hate UNC. So unless you went to Duke, you don't understand. Unless you went to UNC, you don't understand.
It's that intense rivalry. But also, as I was saying to you before we started recording, I took half my, during my doctoral studies, I took half my classes at UNC Chapel Hill. I have so much respect for the faculty and the institution and
and the graduates. Absolutely, absolutely. And you're wearing a Carolina blue shirt today in honor of the University of National Champion. So I understand, appreciate it. So Dr. Darrell, one, I am truly honored to have you on, man. Like, you know how much I respect you. I like to consider myself a person that's pretty well respected in the modern leadership phase of life.
And I know that you were there as well too. But before we get into all of your great work, I like to ask my guest this first question is, what's your because? What's that real why behind the why that keeps you doing what you do, right? You are well acclaimed, right? Lots of awards, lots of articles about you. You have Fortune 100 clients and you're speaking all over the world.
What's your passion? What's your because that keeps you doing what you do? So
Wow. I'm going to get a little emotional here. I'm sorry. No, that's what we're here for. The path I've traveled has included some real hard knocks. And I believe that sometimes a hard road can be a good teacher. And I have learned from that experience how to help people better understand one another. how to help people build trust with one another. And I have a perspective that's unusual.
I won't say it's unique, but it's rare. There's a blend of theory and practice that gives me an unusual perspective on the world. I also have two sons that mean more to me than anything. And when I see the world the way it is now, with trust levels the lowest we've ever seen, our struggles to get along,
I feel like I have an obligation to try to make the world a better place and a strong motivation because of my sons. I want the world to be a better place for them.
Yeah. That's beautiful, man. That's beautiful. You know, and you talk about your unique path and I want to ask you about that and just why trust means so much to you and why it's so important that this is the message that's shared across the world. You know, knowing you like I do, doing a ton of, of studying of you, right? Like you're legally blind.
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Chapter 3: What personal experiences shaped Dr. Stickel's understanding of trust?
Where does vulnerability come from? How do we influence perceptions of outcomes? And what are the emotional stakes? I think the biggest challenge for most organizations is just a complete lack of awareness. Agreed. And so 95% of people believe they're more trustworthy than average.
Like I suspect you and I could go to a prison and we could interview the inmates and say, do you think you're trustworthy? And they go, oh yeah, yeah, you can trust me. Nobody else in this place, but me, I'm, I'm golden. Right. The problem that creates for us is that if we do have a misunderstanding, if we do have a disagreement, I assume it's somebody else's fault.
I don't do the work I need to do and I don't take their perspective into account. Right.
Yeah.
And so, you know, the biggest gap we find is between leader, how much leaders believe they're trusted and how much they actually are. So I think the, the impact that we see is often around creating a vocabulary that people can use. Yeah.
Talking about uncertainty, talking about vulnerability, talking about, you know, what's a good outcome look like being clear and actually having conversations with one another. Um, One of my, you know, my aspirations to be one of the best guests you've ever had, which is a high bar.
But you're doing a great job.
But to do that, I'd have to ask you, what does great look like for you?
Right.
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Chapter 4: Why is trust considered the new currency of leadership?
Yep. We used to have this mindset of you go to school, you work hard, you're going to be successful, you're going to have a house and a family and vacations and the things you want. And a retirement. Yeah. And it doesn't feel like any of that's true anymore. Right. And people sort of denigrate the generations that are following us.
My son gave me this great quote about the kids of today are lazy and ill-informed and lack motivation and it just went on and on. Right. And, and the quote was from the 1930s. Yeah. So this is not a new phenomenon. And what older people like us need to realize is that they're reacting to the context that they're embedded in.
The rules of the game have changed and they have a better understanding of it than we do. Oh, for sure. And so when they don't sell out for a corporation and, You know, when they hear these billionaires saying you need to work harder, what they hear is you need to work harder so I make more money. And I believe that the more senior we become, the less direct control we have over outcomes.
The more we rely on those we lead to reach our goals and objectives.
Totally agree.
So if I'm a leader today, I need to be able to think about how to build a safe harbor. create a place of stability for those I lead so that they're willing to work hard for a shared objective. Yeah.
Yeah. Yeah, we're completely in alignment. So for the business leader, I'm not even saying business owner, but for the business leader, Right. What are some steps that they can take to to start this culture of trust? Like what are two or three things that they can implement today? And I'm going to say think of like the what the the Small Business Association considers a small business.
So twenty five million and under revenue. Right. So that business leader.
OK, so. You're still in a fairly manageable state in terms of being able to have direct connections with your employees at that size. Yeah. Those personal relationships are actually really important. And the levers I think about, particularly when it comes to uncertainty, uncertainty comes from us as individuals and from the context we're embedded in. Right? The rules of the game. And so...
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Chapter 5: What are the common trust deficits leaders face today?
Right. You and I, if we were sitting in the same room, would have the chance to observe different things about each other. Mm-hmm. to have a side conversation after the session to just connect as human beings, right? There'd be a vibe that builds and I feel comfortable with you already. And we haven't really been speaking for all that long, but I just, there's something about it.
And, you know, I've advised companies that are truly global and for them, they say it's the vocabulary. It's not saying, do you trust me? Because people aren't comfortable answering that question. And sometimes they don't know. Right. You know, how much the right response to that question is with what. Right. So I think being able to say, where's your uncertainty at?
What are you feeling vulnerable about right now with this? Yeah. It lets them have conversations that are easier to have. Does that make sense?
It totally makes sense. It totally makes sense. I actually I just took a quick note on that because it's something that I need to start asking my team members. Right. Like I have three different companies and they're remote as well, too. So I need to start asking those questions for us, because while I think we have not, I think I know we have a great culture. I know that we have.
a culture of trust, I still, some of that's assumption, right? Some of that's assumption. So I need to truly make sure by asking the questions.
You have a presence that's comforting. It has wisdom embedded in it. I have no doubt that your teams trust you. I have no doubt that you're a great leader. Yeah. Even you, as skilled as you are, can get better. This is a skill that we can build. Yes. Right.
So absolutely. Absolutely. Well, Darrell, before I let you go, because I know you're busy being gracious with your time. I like to do what I call my quick five segments. So five quick questions. All right. All right. Oh, you went to that school over in Durham. Yeah. D.O.O.K. is how it's spelled for the viewers and listeners in case you didn't know.
So my first question for you, Daryl, because I know that you said you went to Chapel Hill quite a bit, right? Yeah. So the first time that you went to Chapel Hill and then you had to drive back to Durham, how disappointed were you?
LAUGHTER Oh, brother.
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