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Chapter 1: What warning did Keir Starmer give to Andy Burnham regarding the leadership contest?
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Kun kiven iskemä yllättää, Carglass korjaa ja vaihtaa tuulilasit ammattitaidolla ja nopeasti.
Carglass korjaa, Carglass vaihtaa.
Elisaalta kesän kukkeimmat Samsungit. Galaxy A-sarja. Poimi omasi edullisesti. Nyt Elisa myymälöissä ja elisa.fi.
Hello, thank you for your comments about the interview we did with Bridget Phillipson, the Education Secretary, in the previous episode of Newscast. We posted a clip on Instagram and it's had so many comments. And A, reading them for me is amazing because it's an insight into how hard it is being a parent and actually intriguing to hear how things might change when the social media ban comes in.
And then you realise, oh, actually, it's so much more than just a ban on some bits of technology. It's an attempt to kind of rewrite the rules around screens and technology for children, which is definitely the point that Bridget Philipson was trying to make in our conversation with her. And B, it's been interesting seeing some of the people who've got involved in the conversation via Instagram.
For example, Jo Frost, super nanny herself, has engaged with it in emoji form. So we've even got childcare professionals who are... listening to Newscast and responding to some of the things that they've been hearing. So I look forward to seeing how that conversation develops online. And also, please keep your emails and messages coming in. We've had loads of them already. Newscast at bbc.co.uk.
And you can WhatsApp us on 0330 123 9480. And you know what? Maybe we should get more cabinet ministers coming in and just talking for half an hour in a really expansive way about their subject area in a way that excites newscast listeners. There is an idea. Right, we're going to excite you now with the latest on the G7 summit in Evian in France, where Keir Starmer has been representing the UK.
along with the other leaders of the world's richest economies. And we will hopefully catch up with Chris, who's been there and who interviewed Keir Starmer early on Wednesday morning. And we're going to be joined by Alex Forsyth as well, who is on the ground in the Makerfield constituency in the closing hours of this unprecedented by-election campaign.
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Chapter 2: How is the Makerfield by-election impacting political dynamics?
Thinking about it like a panto helped.
Do we play music now or what do we do?
Hello, it's Adam in the newscast studio, and I think this episode is going to be a little bit chaotic because all the other members of the cast family are on location with questionable mobile phone signals. So let's see how this goes. This is London calling somewhere in France. Chris, I don't know exactly where you are.
To be honest, Adam, neither do I, but I can paint a picture. I am currently traveling backwards. I'm on a minibus. In fact, most of the people on this minibus are currently asleep because as we record at lunchtime on Wednesday, we've been up since about...
3.30, 4 o'clock in the morning, your time, because we were doing the round of interviews with the Prime Minister that the broadcast political editors do or tend to do on these foreign trips. We're at the G7 in eastern France and we're currently making our way down the motorway and we'll be at the airport in about half an hour or so, I think. But yeah, I've picked a seat that's going backwards.
Chris, some beautiful logistics travel journalism happening there and plenty of political journalism coming from you in a second as well. Alex is here too. Where are you, Alex?
Hello, I am in the Makerfield constituency where obviously people might have noticed there's a bit of a by-election taking place. So I've been pounding the good streets of Makerfield to get a sense of it all.
Except Makerfield, as we know, isn't a specific place. It's lots of places.
It's like a collection of towns kind of just south of Wigan. So, yeah, Makerfield is the constituency, but the place is made up of places like Hindley and Ashton in Makerfield. So it's like a collection of towns and all the bits in between rather than actually a place like people don't say I'm from Makerfield. They say I'm from Ashton in Makerfield or whatever else it might be.
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Chapter 3: What insights did Alex provide from the ground in Makerfield?
And there's been so much focus, you rightly say, Adam, on the defence investment plan, you know, this idea about how the government's going to come up with the money for future defence spending to match what they call the Strategic Defence Review, which was this big overlook at... what the government might need, what the country might need for its defence in future. But you're right.
I mean, this is an indication that there's already pressure on budgets, which feeds into the big arguments about what the government's priorities are, what the government chooses to spend on, and the trade-offs that it then has to acknowledge publicly that it faces as a consequence of all of that. And just not that everything comes back to the kind of elephant in the room of leadership.
But that is sitting behind all of these conversations right now. You know, the choices that are going to face whoever is leading the government in the next few days and weeks.
And it's interesting that, you know, you heard Keir Starmer when he was talking to Chris last week, making that sort of argument that, you know, whatever happens in the next few days and weeks, there are going to be choices that have to be made from whoever finds themselves in that seat in number 10.
And Chris, the other thing that was then happening on Wednesday, simultaneously with all of this, was the emergence of this news about this incident with the UK-based yacht, with a British couple who were crewing it, receiving warning shots from a Russian vessel off the British coast. And you asked the Prime Minister about that, and here is that bit of the conversation.
Yes, we have a Russia, which is... We've been the fifth year of the conflict in Ukraine. We were discussing that here at the G7. And we know that both Russia and Iran are responsible for proxy attacks in the United Kingdom and across Europe. And we have to be alert. to that. We are dealing with that every single day. They take different forms. But that is the Russia that we are dealing with.
That's why it's so important that an event like this here in France, the G7, where world leaders get together, we discuss the ways in which we address the Iran conflict, the Ukraine conflict, and also what we can do together for the resilience of all of our countries.
Chris, just give me your take on what the Prime Minister was saying there and just why you wanted to phrase that question in that way.
Well, I was very struck yesterday as news of this incident in the Channel began to emerge at how quickly those in government that we're travelling with on this trip were willing to engage with it and said that they would respond to it. And we heard then shortly afterwards publicly from the Ministry of Defence and there was some guidance offered as well from the
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Chapter 4: How does global security influence the discussions at the G7 summit?
international tension and chaos is bad because it leads to unpredictability, which can then spiral into crisis. And okay, this incident in the channel hasn't become an international crisis. It was presumably very scary, as we've heard, for the people on board.
But it just shows you if you've got a world where there's aggression and tension between the UK and Russia, and there are Russian vessels in British waters, then of course, you're going to get incidents like this, which have the potential to go very, very badly wrong. And we're just kind of lucky that in this case, it didn't.
Now, Alex, let's go into the portion of newscast that is kind of going to be the post-Makerfield by-election section. But the fact is the by-election hasn't happened yet because we're recording this on Wednesday and the All's open on Thursday morning. Just give me your take from the streets of Makerfield, which isn't a specific place, but give me the vibe.
The towns of the Makerfield constituency. Yeah, I mean, we've all covered a fair few by-elections and elections in our time, right? But honestly... And I'm trying not to exaggerate this or be too hyperbolic about it all. But this genuinely does feel different because when you even as soon as you get to the constituency, you start to see all the placards up in the window.
And even neighbouring properties might have placards with one house saying I support Robert Kenyon of Reform UK and the next house saying I support Andy Burnham. There's a lot of them across the constituency as you drive round. There are literally just like teams of campaigners and canvassers out on the streets kind of everywhere.
I bumped into a couple who just showed me the leaflets they'd had through their letterbox in the last couple of days. And it was like a fairly thick wad, you know, from all different parties, actually. And in the town of Ashley and Makerfield itself, I was there just trying to get a sense of what people feel and think and the issues that they care about.
And honestly, there was one point where I was bumping into more journalists. than I was local people. I mean, journalists from Poland, you know, just journalists from all over the world. There were a couple of journalists from France on the train when I was on the way to the constituency. So it's obviously there's a reason there's so much focus on this is because we know what's at stake.
We know that Andy Burnham has said if. he wins this by-election contest, then he would enter any leadership contest that was triggered against Keir Starmer. We know there are other parties, including but not exclusively Reform UK, 14 candidates in total fighting this by-election.
But what I think I would glean from what I've picked up so far is the sense that almost everybody in this constituency knows what's at stake as well. They know that they are making a decision that's going to clearly have an impact on the constituency is going to be their representative and what they do for the towns of Makerfield. But it's also got potential consequences for the country.
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Chapter 5: What are the implications of defence spending discussions for the UK?
I say in isolation, there's actually another two by-elections, aren't there, happening tomorrow as well. But clearly, as Alex was saying, this one is on another level because of what is at stake. But in the kind of prosecution of the arguments itself,
in those towns and villages to the south of Wigan it is similar to other by-election campaigns in that you have candidates who are arguing about the degree to which they are authentically local you have a lot of arguments around the specific pledges that candidates are making about the constituency itself how often they're likely to be seen in that constituency or not
if they win etc etc but framed through that wider prism which again to an extent happens at every by-election but this one in particular that wider prism of arguably the central political tussle of right now which is the tussle between the labour party and reform of course there's lots of other tussles in different parts of the uk depending on where you are geographically
Of course there are, but an absolutely central tussle is between the incumbent government and the insurgency of the last few years. And in many senses, Makerfield is a kind of petri dish in that wider discussion and debate with...
at its heart Andy Burnham making an argument which will be the argument he carries on with if if if he wins the by-election don't know if you heard the absolutely volcanic sneeze from Robert Preston of ITV bless you Robert maybe you didn't anyway well I've completely lost my train of thought now oh yeah that was it this is that you know if Andy Burnham can win he will use his victory as a springboard to make an argument nationally particularly to his own party that he can win
beat Reform UK in a way that lots of other Labour folk can't and therefore he should be Prime Minister. That would be the broad, if slightly, from my perspective, crude simplification of the argument we're likely to hear from him in the coming days if he wins.
Newscasters everywhere are now trying to club together to either get a packet of tissues for Robert Peston or a box of antihistamines because he is sneezing away. Thanks for joining in, Robert.
Anyway, Alex, I think another intriguing thing about Makerfield, and bearing in mind everything Chris just said there about it being a sort of petri dish for the whole country and the politics that we might be about to get or the politics that we've already got, it just became about who was the best –
representative for the area who was the best local champion and that's what that happened because that's andy burnham's trump card because he's local and he didn't want it to be about his ambitions in the future and actually for reform they realized oh yeah andy burnham's local so we can't run a campaign that's all about oh he's some carpetbagger from down south who's just using this to get to downing street so of course that ended up being a very local contest
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Chapter 6: What challenges does Keir Starmer face regarding his leadership?
I don't think there should be a challenge because I think that is a bad thing for the country. If there is a challenge, I intend to fight in any challenge to my leadership. Of course I do.
So, yeah, what did you make of what Keir Starmer was saying? He was sort of almost like he was talking to us from the future.
Yeah. And it's intriguing because, as I say, prime ministers generally, and I think this one in particular, pick their words very carefully when they are asked questions about how they may behave in
at a still hypothetical if actually quite realistic and imminent moment in the future for fear that they say something that weakens them so you can understand rationally from their perspective why they might be careful but as various scenarios loom ever larger then prime ministers and their teams will start war gaming what they think might be strategically useful to say out loud and the prime minister came into his round of interviews this morning
having decided that he was going to say that, ooh, well, if Andy Burnham does win the by-election in Makerfield, then, hang on a minute, surely the real imminent priority for the Labour Party, and therefore for him, should be the other vacancy that he would be creating, because you cannot be an MP and the Mayor of Greater Manchester at the same time, so if he wins the by-election.
he will have to relinquish the role as mayor and therefore there'll be a by-election for the Greater Manchester Mayor which could be keenly competitive with reform and the Greens and plenty of others giving it a fair old go and it's a prized jewel if you like in the devolved crown of Labour's current mix of
elected offices so they would obviously want to keep it and the prime minister's argument is well effectively you know Andy Burnham you've caused this first by-election and if you win it you're going to cause another one so in order for Labour to stand still numerically Labour need to hold that by-election so why not focus on that it is telling that team Burnham have said that they regard it as absolutely ludicrous that you would postpone any kind of
question around the leadership until after that mayoral race, not least, they whisper, it would be much harder in their view for Labour to win that mayoral by-election if it comes to pass, with Keir Starmer still as Prime Minister, than in a situation where either he has been replaced or there is a process to replace him.
Chris, I'm going to let you carry on your bus journey because I think your signal is getting a little bit dodgy. So safe travels and see you when you land back on British shores very soon. Goodbye.
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Chapter 7: How are local issues being highlighted in the Makerfield by-election?
No, honestly, I think part of it is that we don't actually know what the next few days are going to be like. We can speculate till the ends of the earth. And of course, we all love doing that. But we don't actually know because you're right. With these things, quite a lot of it can come down to mood and momentum, two of which are quite important factors in politics.
So I think, you know, the result of the Makerfield by-election could set the mood one way or another. And then I think that people who've got their eyes on that top job are going to want to capitalise on any momentum, which is why things might move quite quickly.
But I certainly think over the course of the weekend, the Cabinet will be key because, as we say, Keir Starmer is giving the message today.
again and again and again and of course he would say this wouldn't he until he doesn't but his message is very clearly that he is going nowhere that you know he is he wants to keep his job and he sets out the reasons why he thinks he should but obviously you know you do need the support of your top team and the bulk of your parliamentary party in order to do that and that is where the mood bit of this equation might really come into play post-makerfield depending on the result.
And Alex, as we come to the end of this episode of Newscast, shall we revisit our successful spin-off format by election cast? And would you like to give us one last mini episode of by election cast from the streets of Makerfield as discussed not in an individual place in itself?
Yeah, quite. From the towns, the towns that make up the constituency. We'll just keep saying it until we go blue in the face. Yeah. But yeah, yeah, absolutely. So, I mean, look, we've already touched upon it, but it does feel like a really consequential by-election. And clearly there's lots of focus on Andy Burnham and how he does in this election. There's lots of focus on reform.
And you have to bear in mind that reform and their candidate, Robert Kenyon, well... They are pushing hard here and reform did well in a set of local elections that happened in May. But they are not the only two candidates, despite all the attention and understandable attention that there has been on them. They are not the only two candidates standing in this by-election.
There's that really interesting factor of Rupert Lowe's party, Restore Britain, and their candidate, Rebecca Shepherd, and how they perform in this by-election, what that says about where the arguments might shape up on the right of British politics. And then the list of the 14 other candidates, it is long.
But, you know, I have caught up with some of those over the course of the last couple of days. So, you know, and again, it comes down a lot for them about the battle of sort of localism, if you like.
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Chapter 8: What are the potential consequences of the Makerfield by-election results?
Quite understandably, I think it's fair to say there are others who see this as a kind of A moment when the focus is shifted to the place they live and a place that some of them feel has been overlooked or forgotten for a bit too long. And I think what the hope for many voters in this constituency is, whatever happens after this by-election, that focus doesn't just disappear entirely.
And that some of the or one of the consequences of all of this attention might be that some of the things they really care about get looked at.
I'll just always remember watching that Question Time special from the constituency and ending up zooming in on a map of some waste grounds next to the Sainsbury's because there was an argument about building houses there. I was like, yep, this by-election is just as local as it is national. Oh, Alex, before you go, and I know you've got millions of hours of work to do.
Yesterday, we were chatting to Bridget Phillips in the education section. She was saying when the social media ban comes in, children are just going to have to get used to a very retro thing, which is being bored. What did you do as a child when you were bored? Did you enjoy being bored?
I saw your interview with her and I thought that was totally fascinating, that kind of notion about being bored. I mean, I guess maybe there's an argument that says it's about resilience and learning to entertain yourself. But yeah, I tell you, I almost don't want to tell you because it's going to make me sound like more of a nerd than people might already think I am.
But I genuinely was an avid reader. So I did used to read a lot of books. But I also did the other thing, which maybe other people with sisters might find familiar, which is make up dances.
And I'm just really glad that there weren't camera phones around when I was a kid, because I hate the thought that some of the terrible dances to me, me and my sister made up to pop songs and then forced our family to sit and watch were never recorded on camera so that they could be rolled out at this stage in my life. Thank goodness for it.
Yeah, whenever I was bored, I would just, yeah, write a play or try and put on a show and dragoon everyone into that. So I think we were some, if we'd lived next door to each other, we would have been, we'd probably be in showbiz now.
We could have done it together.
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