Next Level Pros
#130: How Jotform Founder & CEO Aytekin Tank Got Great at Solving One Problem
Mon, 18 Nov 2024
Welcome to a New Episode of Next Level Pros! In today's episode, we're thrilled to have Aytekin Tank, the mastermind behind the transformative software JotForm, which has dramatically altered the landscape of online forms. Aytekin will share his entrepreneurial journey, focusing on the pivotal role of sustained focus and compounded growth in achieving business success. He discusses the evolution of JotForm, from its inception as a simple form builder to a comprehensive suite catering to varied business needs, emphasizing automation and customer-centric development. Stay tuned as Aytekin shares the principles that kept him on track amidst the allure of new opportunities, providing invaluable insights for entrepreneurs at all stages. Apply to be on the show: https://forms.gle/hwDijQPFyKCEtHNs8 Highlights: "We hit oil by digging one hole 1000 feet deep, not 1000 holes one foot deep." "Giving something away for free is the biggest marketing tool you can have." "Automate your busy work to focus on what's truly important." "Persistence is key; you need to learn to pivot and persevere through challenges." Timestamps: 00:00 - Introduction to Aytekin Tank and the genesis of JotForm. 02:52 - Aytekin joins the show; background and initial motivations. 07:13 - The leap from employment to entrepreneurship. 10:34 - Learning from side projects and the transition to full-time on JotForm. 16:41 - The evolution from free to paid subscriptions and early challenges. 23:15 - Expanding JotForm's functionality beyond basic forms. 28:17 - Introduction of enterprise solutions and learning the ropes of sales. 32:20 - Growth and scaling challenges faced over 19 years. 35:16 - The critical importance of focus and saying no to distractions. 41:28 - Where to find Aytekin Tank and closing remarks. Want me to teach you how to grow your business? Text me! 509-374-7554 Want access to more of my content? Click the link below for all of our latest updates and events! https://linktr.ee/nextlevelpros Want to be a guest on our show? Apply here!https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1YlkVBSluEKMTg4gehyUOHYvBratcxHV5rt3kiWTXNC4/viewform?edit_requested=true Watch my latest Podcast Apple - https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/next-level-pros/id1687030281 Spotify - https://open.spotify.com/show/1e0cL2vI1JAtQrojSOA7D2?si=95980cd4e55a437a YouTube- https://www.youtube.com/@NextLevelPros
Chapter 1: What inspired Aytekin Tank to start JotForm?
So at that time, it clicked on my mind that if I ever start my business, this is the product I could build. With that knowledge, I quit my job, I forged it, and I built JotForm.
What's up, Founder Nation? Super excited to bring you this episode with Mr. Itek and Tonk. This guy has built a 600-man empire competing with Google Forms and all kinds of different crazy stuff. The best part about this episode is the focus that this guy has had the last 19 years, not getting distracted. all the shiny objects. You know what I'm talking about if you're an entrepreneur.
There's all kinds of opportunities out there. We want to say yes. One of the best phrases I've ever heard is you can do anything, but you can't do everything. We hit oil by digging one hole a thousand feet deep, not a thousand holes one foot deep. So let's dive into this episode as we talk about focus and compounded growth. Let's go. Yo, yo, yo, welcome to another episode of the Founder Podcast.
Today, I am joined by Mr. Aytekin Tank. Aytekin is tuning in from Turkey, halfway across the world. Super excited to have you. Aytekin's got a phenomenal story. This is a story that you're not gonna wanna miss. We're talking about somebody that has dedicated his life to his craft, that slow growth, consistent, compounding growth,
that really a lot of us entrepreneurs miss out on because we get distracted by the shiny objects. We've got all these other different type of things. And iTechin is proven that if you can just find something that works and continue to dig the hole over and over and over again, eventually you're going to hit oil. He has grown his business since 2005 to now 19 years later to over 600 employees.
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Chapter 2: What challenges did Aytekin face transitioning from employee to entrepreneur?
He's got an incredible software, JotForm, that is utilized throughout the world, doing millions of dollars in revenue. He is a New York Times bestseller, Automating Your Busy Work. He is just well-published, just a well-established entrepreneur. He's super excited to have you on the show, Mr. iTech, and welcome to the show.
Hello, Chris. Great to be on your show. Thank you for that great introduction.
Yeah, man. It's exciting. And I would also share that not only an incredible businessman that has dedicated himself to the craft, but a family man that I just found out married, three children.
For me, as a family man, it's always important to me when I have that similar bond with another business owner because some people, they just dedicate their whole life to business and they don't have this other aspect. So that's really cool. So you started out as a developer for internet.com for five years. In fact, I didn't even know internet.com was a thing. That makes sense, early 2000s.
So you did that for five years. What ultimately led to you saying, you know what? I want to go and do something on my own. What finally clicked or made sense for you?
Yeah. So I've worked for internet.com between 2000 and 2005, and I was a developer. So we had over 100 websites, and these websites were all about things like web development, about all kinds of technology stuff. And while I was working there as a developer, one of my tasks was to create these online forms for our editors.
So I would create these contact forms, surveys, questionnaires, contest forms, payment forms, all kinds of forms. And, like, at that time, like, I kind of hated it because, you know, it wasn't very challenging, like, just, you know, typing HTML to create forms or just, you know, handling the backend to send emails, things like that. So I really didn't enjoy creating forms at that time.
So I wanted to find a product that can actually do that. And I searched for it. There were some products, but they were well done. So at that time, it clicked on my mind that if I ever start my business, this is the product I could build. So at some point, I decided, okay, I can actually make this. I can really do a good job. I can make a great product. And I understood the...
reason people would use that because I've been like building like hundreds of forms for our editors. So I knew like what they needed. So I actually knew the knowledge. So I think that's very important if you're an entrepreneur, like having that firsthand knowledge about like what people need, what people are asking for is really useful. So with that knowledge, I quit my job.
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Chapter 3: How did JotForm evolve from free to paid subscriptions?
I forged it and I built JotForm. And the first year, I made it all free because I wanted to get as many people to use it as possible. It was all free. Even today, it's free. Until you receive 100 form submissions per month, it's all free. We have 25 million users now because we have this free version. That's the biggest marketing tool you can have.
Giving something away for free is the biggest marketing tool. I love that.
So hooking the user in with something free, some sort of offer up front. Let's back up. I mean, you go, you're like, hey, I know this product. I know this is a good solution. I'm going to go do it on my own. Was that scary at all? Walk us through the feeling. I don't know.
19 years ago, it's hard to remember all the emotions that we're going through, but walk us through the emotions of making that initial leap. Because I know a lot of the listeners on here are probably in similar situations. They're like, I want to be an entrepreneur. I'm currently an intrapreneur in my current business. I have a skill set.
But I'm a little like there's no security in going and doing this my own. So like walk us through how that how that went down for you. Yeah.
So I was working in this basement within these cubicles at internet.com. And I remember going up two stairs to my manager. I remember walking up those stairs and I was feeling like my legs were shaking, actually. I was like, what am I doing? Why am I doing this? This was my dream job. And when I graduated college, like studying in the US, computer science was my dream.
Like working on the internet sector, like being a developer was my dream. I reached all those dreams. And now why am I like just quitting this? And just like, you know, like I was asking myself.
What kind of money were you making that time in this dream job? I mean, obviously, 2005, completely different than 2024. But what kind of money were you making in the US?
I think I was making like 75K, something like that. Which? Yeah, I mean... I paid money. Yeah, I mean, yeah, it's great money. Yeah. But at the same time, I was kind of afraid, but I also had this kind of experience doing my own products on the site. That actually gave me the confidence because...
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Chapter 4: What role does focus play in business success?
It's the dedication, the practice, the team building, those type of things. And so you go and you launch this thing and you initially start giving it away for free. And I'm assuming you're probably still running some of these side hustles that are bringing other money or how did that go down?
Exactly. So while I was building JotForm, I actually continued the same way I did before I quit my job. So instead of going to my full-time job, I would actually start working on jazz form. So I was living in Brooklyn at that time. I would just, uh, just like I would go to office, I would just go out and start working in, in a, in a cafe in Brooklyn Heights.
And I would walk the Brooklyn bridge to Manhattan and I would just, Spent all my day working from different cafes and start building JotForm that way. It was all fun, but at the same time, I would still work on my customs. I will still take care of my existing customers. I dedicated my time to the new product because I really believed in this product would be successful because I saw the need.
And the other thing is like the other products I built, all the side gigs, they didn't have this growth curve. Like they were kind of stuck in slow growth. So that's also another thing you learn when you do things on the side. What kind of business model doesn't work?
For example, selling software as a single copy, single version doesn't really scale, doesn't work because you have to find a customer for every sale, right? But when you build a subscription software, when you build a service,
that people pay every month or every month, every year, that scales because if your product is good, if you don't have churn, if you have high retention rate, that it's going to snowball. It's going to start very slowly. And for example, the first year it was all free, right? 2006, I released Chatform.
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Chapter 5: How important is persistence in entrepreneurship?
Chapter 6: What lessons did Aytekin learn from side projects?
For me, as a family man, it's always important to me when I have that similar bond with another business owner because some people, they just dedicate their whole life to business and they don't have this other aspect. So that's really cool. So you started out as a developer for internet.com for five years. In fact, I didn't even know internet.com was a thing. That makes sense, early 2000s.
So you did that for five years. What ultimately led to you saying, you know what? I want to go and do something on my own. What finally clicked or made sense for you?
Yeah. So I've worked for internet.com between 2000 and 2005, and I was a developer. So we had over 100 websites, and these websites were all about things like web development, about all kinds of technology stuff. And while I was working there as a developer, one of my tasks was to create these online forms for our editors.
So I would create these contact forms, surveys, questionnaires, contest forms, payment forms, all kinds of forms. And, like, at that time, like, I kind of hated it because, you know, it wasn't very challenging, like, just, you know, typing HTML to create forms or just, you know, handling the backend to send emails, things like that. So I really didn't enjoy creating forms at that time.
So I wanted to find a product that can actually do that. And I searched for it. There were some products, but they were well done. So at that time, it clicked on my mind that if I ever start my business, this is the product I could build. So at some point, I decided, okay, I can actually make this. I can really do a good job. I can make a great product. And I understood the...
reason people would use that because I've been like building like hundreds of forms for our editors. So I knew like what they needed. So I actually knew the knowledge. So I think that's very important if you're an entrepreneur, like having that firsthand knowledge about like what people need, what people are asking for is really useful. So with that knowledge, I quit my job.
I forged it and I built JotForm. And the first year, I made it all free because I wanted to get as many people to use it as possible. It was all free. Even today, it's free. Until you receive 100 form submissions per month, it's all free. We have 25 million users now because we have this free version. That's the biggest marketing tool you can have.
Giving something away for free is the biggest marketing tool. I love that.
So hooking the user in with something free, some sort of offer up front. Let's back up. I mean, you go, you're like, hey, I know this product. I know this is a good solution. I'm going to go do it on my own. Was that scary at all? Walk us through the feeling. I don't know.
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Chapter 7: How does automation contribute to business growth?
And the earlier you can start, the better. So don't just wait for like, I will quit my job one day and I will start my business. Start it now. You don't need to wait for it. Even if you work like one hour a day, the amount of learnings you will have will accumulate. And when you quit your job, you will have all the experience you need to actually do a good job.
And you will also have the confidence. And if you can actually start building your product beforehand, That also helps so that you can focus on like growing your business as opposed to like starting from scratch.
Couldn't agree more. I think there's too much unnecessary risk, right? Like a lot of people associate being an entrepreneur with risk, which there's very much so risk involved with being an entrepreneur, but like hedged risk and proper risk is absolutely necessary. And so this actually ties into like one of our previous episodes when we talked about like the side hustles
that you can be building on the side. Each one of us have 168 hours in a week. Most of us dedicate 40 of that to our jobs, to our economics, and going and growing. And then you have 40 hours dedicated to sleep, another 20 hours dedicated to family. There is time. There is always time if you prioritize what you have going on to be able to go and do exactly like Aytekin said,
go and just build your own product on the side, right? There's no need to go and just immediately put all your eggs in one basket and take all the risk when you can get paid to be educated. I am a big proponent, just as you, I take in that, like, Go and get a paid education. Learn from other people. See what you're good at.
Identify the ways that you can go and impact the marketplace and do it on somebody else's risk and somebody else's dime. And then the other thing I would point out here is that sometimes entrepreneurship isn't that sexy. Your product doesn't have to be that sexy. Forms, there's nothing super...
oh man this this is the the best thing in the world or so amazing or awesome or whatnot like i'm sure you saw there's just like this is just something that people need and i'm good at it and i can go and provide a solution that's better right and so it uh it just goes to prove that like Successful entrepreneurship isn't necessarily in the product.
It's the dedication, the practice, the team building, those type of things. And so you go and you launch this thing and you initially start giving it away for free. And I'm assuming you're probably still running some of these side hustles that are bringing other money or how did that go down?
Exactly. So while I was building JotForm, I actually continued the same way I did before I quit my job. So instead of going to my full-time job, I would actually start working on jazz form. So I was living in Brooklyn at that time. I would just, uh, just like I would go to office, I would just go out and start working in, in a, in a cafe in Brooklyn Heights.
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Chapter 8: What are the key insights for aspiring entrepreneurs from Aytekin's journey?
It was all free, but I was getting like I was alone at that time, like just subscription, like free users gradually. But in 2007, I worked on some paid like plan for that features. So when I released that incident, I got like 500 subscribers. And at that time, it was just $9 a month. So it was only like $4,500 per month. But it wasn't big.
But because the product was good, because people were insuring, that continued to increase over the years. And so, you know, even today, like we have customers who has been with us for more than 10 years for a long time. And it's just it's very important, like because in a subscription product, in a product that's like people pay as they go along.
you have that motivation to keep them happy because it adds up. And that's a great business model. But when you have to find a customer for every sale, it just doesn't add up. And instead of making existing customers happy, you're focused on the new sales all the time. And that's just... I prefer working on the quality of my product as opposed to just...
You know, making flashy, you know, trying to find new customers.
For sure. I love that. So initially you had that free product. When you made the conversion and started offering the $9 a month, how many free subscriptions did you have active at that time?
At that time, we had like 15,000 free users. And then once I released that paid version, I was able to convert like 500 to them to the paid version. I remember as soon as I announced the new paid version, half an hour later, someone from Spain, it was very early in the morning. So someone from Spain was the first customer, then someone from the UK, I believe, and then from the East Coast.
And then all these subscribers trickling in. And it was a great feeling. Even though they were just paying $9, it was an amazing feeling.
Let's dig into a little bit more granular. You bootstrapped this thing for the last 19 years, and you've slowly added different products or different features to your product, slowly added employees, slowly added these things, right? Yeah. How have you been able to say so focused?
Because I'm imagining there's been distractions or been other opportunities that have been presented over the last 19 years. How have you been able to just make sure you hone in and continue down this path of like, this is our strategy. This is how we go to market. This is what I'm dedicated to. Yeah.
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