*Content warning: descriptions of medical trauma, death, infant loss, birthing trauma, medical trauma, medical neglect, mature and stressful themes. *Free + Confidential Resources + Safety Tips: somethingwaswrong.com/resources Moms Advocating For MomsS23 survivors Markeda, Kristen and Amanda have created a nonprofit, Moms Advocating for Moms, in hopes to create a future where maternal well-being is prioritized, disparities are addressed, and every mother has the resources and support she needs to thrive: https://www.momsadvocatingformoms.org/take-actionhttps://linktr.ee/momsadvocatingformoms Please sign the survivors petitions below to improve midwifery education and regulation in Texashttps://www.change.org/p/improve-midwifery-education-and-regulation-in-texas?recruiter=1336781649&recruited_by_id=74bf3b50-fd98-11ee-9e3f-a55a14340b5a&utm_source=share_petition&utm_campaign=share_for_starters_page&utm_medium=copylink Malik's Law https://capitol.texas.gov/BillLookup/History.aspx?LegSess=89R&Bill=HB4553 M.A.M.A. has helped file a Texas bill called Malik's Law, which is intended to implement requirements for midwives in Texas to report birth outcomes in hopes of improving transparency and data collection in the midwifery field in partnership with Senator Claudia Ordaz. *Sources:American College of Nurse Midwiveshttps://midwife.org/ American College of Obstetricians and Gynecologists (ACOG)https://www.acog.org/ Birth Settings in America: Outcomes, Quality, Access, and Choice, Maternal and Newborn Care in the United Stateshttps://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK555484/#:~:text=Federal%20law%20requires%20that%20most%20insurance%20companies,if%20they%20and%20their%20babies%20are%20healthy.&text=Midwives7%20provide%20care%20throughout%20the%20prenatal%20period%20for%20families%20planning%20a%20home%20birth. Cooling Therapy Treatment for HIEhttps://birthinjurycenter.org/hypoxic-ischemic-encephalopathy-hie/cooling-treatment-for-hie/#:~:text=Clinical%20trials%20have%20shown%20that,of%20death%20or%20brain%20damage. March of Dimeshttps://www.marchofdimes.org/peristats/about-us National Midwifery Institutehttps://www.nationalmidwiferyinstitute.com/midwifery North American Registry of Midwives (NARM)https://narm.org/ Postpartum Hemorrhagehttps://my.clevelandclinic.org/health/diseases/22228-postpartum-hemorrhage Raynaud's diseasehttps://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/raynauds-disease/symptoms-causes/syc-20363571 State investigating Dallas birth center and midwives, following multiple complaints from patientshttps://www.wfaa.com/article/news/local/investigates/state-investigating-dallas-birth-center-midwives-following-multiple-complaints-from-patients/287-ea77eb18-c637-44d4-aaa2-fe8fd7a2fcef Texas Department of Licensing and Regulation (TDLR)https://www.tdlr.texas.gov/ Zucker School of Medicine, Amos Grunebaum, MDhttps://faculty.medicine.hofstra.edu/13732-amos-grunebaum/publications *SWW S23 Theme Song & Artwork: Thank you so much to Emily Wolfe for covering Glad Rag’s original song, U Think U for us this season!Hear more from Emily Wolfe:On SpotifyOn Apple Musichttps://www.emilywolfemusic.com/instagram.com/emilywolfemusicGlad Rags: https://www.gladragsmusic.com/ The S23 cover art is by the Amazing Sara StewartFollow Something Was Wrong:Website: somethingwaswrong.com IG: instagram.com/somethingwaswrongpodcastTikTok: tiktok.com/@somethingwaswrongpodcast Follow Tiffany Reese:Website: tiffanyreese.me IG: instagram.com/lookiebooSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.
Chapter 1: What is the content warning and resources provided in this episode?
Something Was Wrong is intended for mature audiences. This season contains discussions of medical negligence, birth trauma, and infant loss, which may be upsetting for some listeners. For a full content warning, sources, and resources, please visit the episode notes.
Opinions shared by the guests of the show are their own and do not necessarily represent the views of myself, Broken Cycle Media, and Wondery. The podcast and any linked materials should not be misconstrued as a substitution for legal or medical advice. Origins Birth and Wellness owners and midwives Caitlin Wages and Gina Thompson have not responded to our requests for comment.
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Chapter 2: What happened during Kristen’s childbirth experience?
My baby was born at 10 o'clock that morning. With the history of what was going on, they called in some NICU personnel. They did care for him after he was born. He was not breathing. I was terrified. Then also it's like starting up this new massive amount of fear of like what's ahead of us. My OB, she was the delivery OB and then she was the one that followed up on me until I was discharged.
I thought she was good during delivery. I had no concerns. I actually felt quite comfortable and safe with her there when I was being discharged from the hospital. My OB came in with my discharge paperwork to go over it. I wanted to know where I was in terms of the spectrum of severity because I feel pretty torn up. She looked at me and she said, you did push for two and a half hours.
That's kind of the max that we'll let people go to. I mean, you're pretty bad. I was like, yeah, kind of rolling my eyes. Plus the six hours I pushed at the birth center. She looked at me and she said, what do you mean you pushed at the birth center? And I said, I thought that was why my cervix was so swollen. Obviously, she wasn't given this information by Origins. She was shocked.
She said, you're not supposed to push until you're fully dilated, 10 centimeters. You weren't fully dilated when you got here. So why were you pushing? She said, do you know what could have happened? You could have torn your cervix. And I later found out that if you tear a cervix, you can hemorrhage and bleed out. I lost it.
When she told me that, that was the moment that everything changed for the rest of my life. We went home Tuesday evening late. Those days following, I was unable to take deep breaths. I could only take shallow breaths for days. It was terrifying. It was like I was hyperventilating almost.
And I brought that up to the OB and she said, well, I would attribute to the fact that you probably have some swelling in your lungs. Your muscles are sore. You fatigued your muscles. She said, I would not be surprised if you injured yourself. a lot more in your abdomen than you realize.
Not only are my reproductive parts messed up, you expect those parts to be inflamed and swollen, beat up and bruised, but you wouldn't expect your lungs. Maybe that was naive of me, but I had never heard of anybody else that complained of having an elephant on their chest for several days post birth.
A few days after the birth happened, I felt like something was seriously wrong with the way that they treated us. So I actually had my husband go on to my portal and take screenshots of the notes. I just need a record of everything that happened. My husband downloaded these notes on the 16th of October, and my baby was born the 10th.
Six days after, I definitely felt like something was very much wrong. Ashlyn did reach out at one point to say, Kurt, it wasn't great. Would love to chat about it. Hope you and your son are doing well. But I never responded to that text because I was so angry.
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Chapter 3: How did Kristen's OB respond to complications after birth?
But I was constantly in the bathroom. I thought, oh my gosh, I'm going to have to start cathing myself. This is going to back up and become a kidney infection. Like all these things are going through my head. My mom, who is a nurse, she was there at the time that this was happening, but I went to her and I can't pee, mom, what's going on? And she said, maybe you have a UTI. You're so swollen.
It could be that you have a lot going on down there right now, but go get checked out. So I went to a local minute clinic. She's like, yeah, it kind of looks cloudy. So my guess is you have a UTI, but it was a Friday. So she was going to send the culture in, but it wouldn't come back until Monday. So she sent me with an antibiotic that I started taking that day.
Who knows if it was the right antibiotic or not, but we started it. But I called my OB. I wanted to keep her updated. She said, what do you mean you started an antibiotic today? You should have been on antibiotics since I discharged you. Why were you not taking your antibiotics? I was like, you didn't prescribe me antibiotics. I haven't been taking them because I was never prescribed them.
I pulled out my discharge paperwork that she gave me and we went over that she marked on with her pen. And I said, there's an iron supplement on here and an ibuprofen recommendation. She claimed I was supposed to be on an antibiotic because I had an infection at birth. That's what she said to me. That was not in my paperwork anywhere.
So don't really know if she thought I was a different patient, but the antibiotic helped. I was able to start peeing again a few days later. Thank God. I went in for my two-week visit with her then. Already a little bit on edge because she acted like I was lying that there was no antibiotic mentioned in my paperwork.
But I went in by myself because my husband was working and I got on the bed in the office. My OB comes in, her happy self, and takes a look down there. You can't make this stuff up. And I have to laugh at it now, otherwise I just get angry. But she looked down and pops up and she's like, well, there's been a separation of church and state down here. That's what she said to me.
And those words stick out in my mind because it was just so nonchalant and to me insensitive because I'm in pain. I'm scared. I'm hurting. I don't know who's got my back and who doesn't because it seems like all these care providers are somehow just like skipping over important things. So when she said that, I thought, are you kidding me? That's what you're going to say to me after all this?
I had a second degree tear at delivery that she stitched. She's like, well, it looks like your stitch has failed. Your tear's open. That doesn't sound great. What are the implications of this thing? And so she told me that I would need to be put under to have it repaired.
And the anesthesia meant that I would need to pump and dump and that it would prolong my recovery time, which also didn't sound great. But then being put under didn't sound wonderful. I'd had it. I don't want to see another hospital or doctor. I don't want to at this point. I don't trust anybody. Why would I want to go under and have you operate on me when it seems like you've already failed me?
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Chapter 4: What complications did Kristen face after delivery and how were they handled?
In the early hours of December 4th, 2024, CEO Brian Thompson stepped out onto the streets of midtown Manhattan.
This assailant pulls out a weapon and starts firing at him.
We're talking about the CEO of the biggest private health insurance corporation in the world. And the suspect.
He has been identified as Luigi Nicholas Mangione.
Became one of the most divisive figures in modern criminal history.
I was targeted, premeditated, and meant to sow terror.
I'm Jesse Weber, host of Luigi, produced by Law & Crime and Twist. This is more than a true crime investigation. We explore a uniquely American moment that could change the country forever.
He's awoken the people to a true issue.
Finally, maybe this would lead rich and powerful people to acknowledge the barbaric nature of our health care system.
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Chapter 5: What was Kristen’s experience with follow-up care and patient advocacy?
I know there's a lot of women that paid a lot of money that are due a refund just as I was. Why are they withholding that stuff if they're not just out to make money off of us and move on? It literally says in our contract that they'll perform an audit and refund us the money that we're due if we're due any money. The trauma that I went through and processing it all.
The last thing on my mind was going through my contract and reading that thing about the fact that they're supposed to do an audit. So I didn't even start thinking about that until someone brought it up. And I was like, oh, no one ever audited my chart. No one ever audited my finances. And once I went through and pulled all of my insurance statements, I found a lot of money that I'm owed.
I was in contact with them several months ago, the financial person. She was actually at the point of being willing to send me a refund check, which was still not the full refund that I was due, but it was a portion. And I was like, I'll take that portion, you know, and at least then fight for the rest later. I already knew that they were being a little hesitant about giving people their refunds.
I also found an additional receipt that I hadn't tacked on to the refund amount that they actually owed me. And so then I emailed back and I said, here's the receipt for some more that I paid that I'm owed back per your contract. I never received correspondence from her from then on. That was my first experience with birth. The beauty of birth, it was stolen from me.
If the worst had happened, if I had torn, if I had hemorrhaged, would I have died at the birth center? It didn't happen, thank God, but my mind goes there sometimes. I was putting my life in their hands. I was just drowning in anxiety, fear, feeling violated, and then feeling angry. I myself was a medical professional. I mean, I worked in the NICU. Why did I miss the red flags?
Was I being oblivious? Was I being too proud and thinking like, well, I'm going to be just fine? Those emotions really ate at me. Some of it was the embarrassment that I had chosen to go there and that I had failed. It was like my body failed me. I failed me. Those first few months are a blur to me.
I think I blacked out a lot of those memories, honestly, because it was just such a dichotomy between the anger and the trauma at the same time having this cute, beautiful, amazing little thing that's like all mine that my body made. It was too much for my brain to handle. And it makes me so sad now looking back at pictures of him when he was little and being like, oh, I forgot that that happened.
People talk about the glow you have as a first time mom. I didn't have that. I was just out of my brains and I'll never get that time back. I felt like that was stolen from me. They stole a lot of time from me and they stole a lot of memories from me. And they stole this piece of me that I never consented to them taking. It was like no one understood what we had gone through.
Those months following were the hardest months of my life. I went several months feeling isolated, abandoned, forgotten. All of these negative thoughts that just swarm in your mind.
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Chapter 6: How did Kristen handle the decision about surgical repair of her tear?
He was so helpless and no one's guiding him. No one's telling him what's going on. He has no idea. I had no idea. But I know that he carries a lot of hurt and a lot of shame and guilt. I mean, none of it's deserved. My husband was also a victim. And I know that I was the one that everyone was scared about and my baby was the one that everyone was scared about in that moment.
Each of you suffered your own kind of trauma.
Yeah, and I think that sometimes his is overlooked. He's had to deal with my emotional outbursts or all of the mess and the muck that has come of this because he, such a good man that he is, feels like I need to have my wounds healed first and my pain and my trauma needs to be addressed first because it's been so debilitating and he's put himself to the side.
But he still carries it and yet no one's really asked him. It wasn't until May of 2023, seven months later, I finally had a point where I was like, I'm living in desolation. I'm living in this black cloud that just surrounds my days. I wake up in fear. I go to bed in tears. I literally don't recognize myself anymore. I realized something had to be done.
And that's when I reached out to a counselor. I also told myself I have to put myself out there. I started going to mom's groups through various churches. But then I met this new emotion when I would put myself out there. Resentment of other moms because I was so heated to realize what I missed out on. birth is so lovely and it's beautiful and like your body was made to do this.
I had so much resentment when I heard people talk about their good birth stories. I was happy for them, obviously, in one sense. I would wish nothing like what I had on anybody. But then there was also this side of me that was so resentful. I didn't want to hear those stories.
I didn't want to hear someone else rave about, especially a birth center birth or even a home birth, that those things worked out for somebody else, but not for me. I started counseling and was able to start talking about it. I literally up until this point for months thought I was the only one that had gone through this at Origins. I was scrolling social media one day.
At this time, I had already moved out of Texas and saw a news report out of Texas that some women were gathering and they were going to be demonstrating outside of an Origins location. I clicked on the article and read it, and sure enough, it was Origins Dallas. And I thought, oh my gosh, I'm not the only one. In the article, it was Amanda who had been interviewed by the reporter.
I was nervous reaching out to her, honestly. I didn't want to dredge up old memories, but I'm so glad I did. I reached out to Amanda online, and I think it was via the Origins page, because at the time, Origins was still running. And I just simply said, hey, I saw this review. It sounds like you had a bad experience.
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Chapter 7: What financial and trust issues did Kristen encounter with the birth center?
And to hear her say that, that she thought I was strong, because I feel like half of me thinks I've been strong and then the other half of me thinks I'm just being a wimp. And so to hear her say that she thought I'd been strong was just really meaningful. I think it validated that piece of me that wants to give myself grace and yet hasn't been able to.
I've realized that hearing the people that went through it, that had the same midwives, that were in that same building, that saw the same OB, their words that they speak when they reiterate their story and share it, it's what I feel. We really were treated extremely poorly and I need to stop excusing them. It's feeling comfort in the empathy from somebody else.
I hate that they had to go through it, but it's like someone else went through it too and they're surviving and I'm going to also. It's not a misery loves company thing. It's just knowing that someone else can empathize. I'm not lonely anymore.
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I am in no way anti-midwifery. I still love the midwifery model. And in fact, with my second baby, I went with midwives. They were all CNMs. They all delivered in a hospital setting. I don't regret that at all. They were amazing, lovely people who knew their stuff. They absolutely came through for me. They did a great job with my second, but the trauma still came back.
I really wanted to try to have a redemptive birth experience to prove to myself that my body could do it. There's also this reality that we have to confront, which is that we don't know how your body is going to react in any situation, really. The sad thing is, as much as I thought I had worked through that trauma, as the time got closer to having my second, I started having irrational thoughts.
Like, I don't think I'm going to make it out the other side of this. I think I'm going to go into that hospital and be in labor and I'm going to die. And then once we were there at the hospital in labor, I wanted so desperately to try to do it all by myself. The contractions got so bad and I knew it was nearing that time and I thought, I can't do this again.
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Chapter 8: How did the trauma of the birth experience affect Kristen emotionally?
We have a video of the birth, well, of part of it. And you can see when she gets panicked and she says, you have to get this baby out now. You need to stand up. So I stand up in the tub. I put one leg up on the side, his head's kind of crowning. And then she said something along the lines of like, I'm going to have to help you. And she's got a scalpel in her hand.
part of me wishes she would have just given me the episiotomy and helped me get him out. Whatever would have stopped the situation from happening.
We beeline it down to Baylor University Medical Center in Dallas. I don't understand the gravity of the situation at the time. I walk into L&D and there is a nurse pacing back and forth in the hall. I walk up to the desk and say, hi, you know, I'm Barbie. I'm here checking in. And I look on her desk and It has my name written, big letters, Barbie Dash, severe preeclampsia.
And I'm like, why does she have that written? No one has brought up preeclampsia to me at this point. The nurse that was pacing, she comes over to me. She's like, come with me. I'm thinking in my mind, they must be a low census or something because she was just hanging out waiting for me, not realizing that I was in grave danger at the time.
In sharing my story with people, I've had so many people, especially women, tell me about their own birth trauma. They even admit telling me about their partner's birth trauma.
When I had that conversation with Caitlin one week postpartum, I told her that I was going to be the voice for the moms that didn't feel like they could stand up for themselves. When me and Kristen and Markita started talking about all of this, we just wanted to save one mom and one baby. And I think we've done that. I think we've saved tons of moms and tons of babies already.
Malik's Law, HB 4553, it was introduced into house in March. It's basically requiring for midwives to report outcomes related to transfer, mortality, morbidity rates, because the reporting that they do is within like a closed system. So it's not open to the public. The everyday consumer cannot view these statistics.
Commissioners, my name is Kristen, and I am a founding member of Moms Advocating for the Moms Alliance and a past client of licensed midwives in the state of Texas. I am here today because Texas mothers and babies are suffering, not because of chance, but because of a system that fails to protect them.
CDLR claims to safeguard Texans, but I am alive today despite their lack of due diligence, not because of it.
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