In June 2025, indie veterans Deerhoof scrubbed their entire catalog from the world’s dominant streaming platform. The catalyst wasn't low royalties, but Spotify co-founder Daniel Ek’s investment in AI military technology through his investment firm Prima Materia. Greg Saunier and Satomi Matsuzaka explain why they are prioritizing their ethics over exposure. They argue that the "convenience" of streaming traps us in harmful systems. They’d prefer listeners explore alternative paths to hear their music. That’s why the band premiered their latest single on Craigslist. And it’s they half jokingly say they "would rather our fans steal our music than stream our music at this point." SONGS DISCUSSED Deerhoof: Immigrant Song, Scarcity is Manufactured, Life is Suffering, Return of the Return of the Fire Trick Star MORE Get Zach Tenorio's synth extraveganza 'Field Trip' Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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“What did the council decide on item 42?” — answered with the speaker and the moment.