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Sword and Scale

Episode 341

01 Mar 2026

Transcription

Chapter 1: What is the main topic discussed in this episode?

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Picture yourself immersed in the magic of County Leitrim. Find adventure along trails that embrace quiet lakes and winding rivers, leading you to hidden gems where lively festivals fill the air with music and laughter. Or catch your breath where good food and friendly faces come together. Explore waterfalls that whisper stories and wander through our hidden forests.

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Picture yourself in Leitrim, where time slows down and moments last forever. Visit enjoyleitrim.com, funded by The Leader Program. Sword and Scale contains adult themes and violence and is not intended for all audiences. Listener discretion is advised. That they had a big fight and journalists were the guy. 2026 has been a weird year, hasn't it? It's barely begun. Man...

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When everyone looks at something and half the population sees one thing and the other half sees something completely different, we're cooked. We are done. Stick a fork in it. This is season 13, episode 341, by the way, and it's all about trying to figure out what's right when nothing is. You know, kind of like 2026. Let's talk about something most people don't think about until it's too late.

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If you drink, even occasionally, you already know how unpredictable the next morning can be. Sometimes you're fine. Sometimes you're not. That's where liqueur comes in. Liqueur makes gummies designed to help prevent hangovers by supporting your body while it processes alcohol.

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The formula is built around DHM, a compound derived from the Hovenia dulcis tree that helps break down acetaldehyde, the toxic byproduct responsible for a lot of hangover symptoms. They also include milk thistle and prickly pear for liver support, B vitamins and electrolytes to help with dehydration and energy loss, and ginger root to reduce nausea. It's not about masking symptoms.

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It's about helping your body recover faster. They're easy to take, portable, and practical, whether you're out for the night or having drinks at home. One customer summed it up perfectly. I woke up feeling like I hadn't drank the night before. I've arranged the highest discount they offer, 20% off. go to liqueur.com, that's L-I-Q-U-R-E dot com, and use promo code S-W-O-R-D at checkout.

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It was March 8th, 2021, in the small community of Mickleton, New Jersey. Police cars swarmed the neighborhood. Flashes of blue light started across the living room windows. The quiet street was swallowed by chaos. I look out the window and there are a bunch of, you know, police officers were out here. And when we had to come out and see what the commotion was about, and it wasn't good.

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It wasn't good. In a community with crime rates well below the national average, no one expected a violent crime, let alone the murder of a senior citizen. This rare crime would go down as the only murder in the community for years. Never issues like this, never seen anything like this. Everybody kind of, you know, keeps themselves in neighborhoods, really nice people.

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Everybody, it's just, it's a shock when something like this happens. 66-year-old Michael Debkowski was found murdered in his laundry room. He was bludgeoned in the head, his face masked in a sweatshirt. The only thing missing from the home was his car. I was really shocked. I was really upset to find out who it was. Mike was a real good guy.

Chapter 2: What events led to the murder of Michael Debkowski?

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And I said, Sean, you need some PTSD help. You need some help with this. This is too much. Sean was never the same after his tour in Kosovo. Lingering mental scars added to his already damaged mental health. It seemed his whole perspective on life had shifted. He divorced his first wife when he came home. He told me there could be no God because of what he saw.

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What he saw in combat took a toll on Sean. But it wasn't long before the old Sean started to shine through. For a short time, Sean seemed content, but it wouldn't last. It was while he was with Liz that he met Jennifer Whitman. She was in her home nurse. That's how they met. She was in there working, and that's how they met.

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It wasn't long after Jen started working as an in-home nurse for Sean and Liz that a relationship developed. And they were having a secret, you know, a secret affair at that point, which eventually came out. She was married to somebody else. They had an affair. And then it just, they were just like, you know, star-crossed lovers and everything was like wonderful and everything like that.

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At that point, she left her first husband. They got together. Both Sean and Jen were already married, but that didn't seem to matter. Their affair turned into a full-fledged relationship, and then they got married. She went off for Sean, did what they did. They got married in March of 2013. None of us were there. We found out through Facebook.

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Their relationship blossomed, and it wasn't long before they welcomed their first child into the world, a little girl. About a year later, they had a second little girl. Not long after that, Jen was pregnant again, this time with a boy. From the outside, everything was perfect. He had a decent job. He was good at his job. He enjoyed his job. He enjoyed being able to provide. He liked that.

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Sean was a hard worker. He was an excellent dad. He loved Jen, and he did anything for Jen. I mean, through the years, they seemed to be okay. But behind the scenes, the couple was struggling.

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On some level, she wanted that picture of them because they grew up in church and, you know, everybody wants to be married and, you know, have that happy little house with the white picket fence and kids running around. She wanted to put on a facade that she was all together and she could maintain that for a while until the need for, you know, drugs took over.

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Jen started to slip into drug addiction. Jen was having some troubles with prescription drugs. She hurt her back before she left her first husband, and she was on some pain pills for her back. It started slowly at first, but then escalated quickly. She lost her nursing license because of her addiction and sank deeper into it.

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Soon, there were issues that couldn't be missed, even through the facade of the perfect life. And the first time Dyfus was called... in New Jersey was because she was violent. She was on the drugs. She was violent. And she threw, like, bar chairs at them. And the babysitter got mad. The babysitter called them.

Chapter 3: Who was Sean Lannan and what was his relationship with Mike?

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They're taking the kids. I got home. There was Dyphus in my house. And so we had the kids for the next 49 days while... She was supposed to be getting herself together. Sean was getting therapy. And that was their life. A cycle of Jen strung out on opiates, going to rehab, getting out, and eventually relapsing again.

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All the while, they were trying to convince DYFS that the kids weren't in danger. Sean worked at an oil refinery, putting in a lot of hours. Sometimes he would be gone for weeks at a time, leaving the kids with Jen. This led to a lot of calls to DYFS. Needless to say, they weren't convinced. But in late 2017, Sean got an opportunity within his company. He was offered another job in New Mexico.

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They were getting ready to move into Mexico about three or four years ago, I think it was. I'm sure they both looked at it as a fresh start in a new state. Sean moved to New Mexico with the kids and Jen returned to rehab. You know, she got out of rehab. She came back. He divorces her. He takes her to, you know, diocese and gets her parental rights taken away.

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She didn't really deserve any parental rights. They were divorced just by paper. They were still together as a husband and wife. All right. They never left each other, only the time that Jen was in the rehab for three or four months. So I knew about it. I didn't know why. I think from what I understood, it was that they were going to lose custody of the kids if they stayed married.

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So they got a divorce so Sean could hold full custody of the kids and the kids would be safe. So they wouldn't lose it because Jen was going through her drug problem. Of course, Jen was still there. She lived in the house with Sean and the kids. She had no rights on paper, but in reality, when Sean wasn't home, she had full responsibility for their three small children.

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Taking care of her kids was difficult for Jen. She often chose her addiction over her children. Then, Sean got sick. I wasn't really with a nanny these past couple of years, but when Sean got diagnosed with cancer, I was there a lot. I want to say it's his lungs. I think it's mesothelioma. I'm not sure. I know he was seeing a doctor. I used to take him to treatments every day up until October.

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When he was real bad, when he first started getting PMO, he used to have to be just walked to the bathroom and everything. He could barely stand up. So I would stay there a lot of times. I would stay there. Sean was so sick that he was physically wrecked. Jen wasn't any help. So they had to hire a nanny to help take care of the kids. Then Sean lost his job because of all the time off.

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The little money they had started to dwindle fast. And the problems with Jen got worse. Jen had run off with somebody after we had an argument that she hit him with a frying pan and he was bruised up and... And marked up from that, and then she ran off with some guy that went to Arizona. That they had a big fight. And Jen left with a guy.

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According to Sean, Jen abandoned her family at their lowest point. It's unlike my daughter to go two weeks without calling us. Then I went up three weeks. It's unlike my daughter not calling us or texting us three weeks. January, February, moved forward, talked to my parents about finding a missing person report because Sean wasn't really communicating to my parents as much.

Chapter 4: What triggered Sean Lannan's violent actions against Mike?

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And they're getting better. You could see in their face, they got better color. They're eating better. They're growing, it seems like. God knows what they've been through. I mean... You know, if they were left alone, to fend for themselves. It's heartbreaking to think of what those kids must have experienced. But now, they're safe.

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The way Sean Lannan was arrested was about as peaceful a way as a national manhunt could end. And when he was caught... He confessed. And he didn't just confess once. He confessed in every jurisdiction in which he committed a crime. He pleaded guilty in New Jersey to the murder of Michael Dubkowski. He was sentenced to 35 years in prison.

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He pleaded guilty in New Mexico for the murders of Justin Mata, Matthew Miller, Jennifer Lannan, and Randall Apostolon. He was given 15 years each for 60 years total. He'll serve the 35 years in New Jersey first, then be transferred to New Mexico. Murderer, may you live your life miserably, feel the pain which you deserve to feel daily about taking the lives of innocent people.

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I can only wish it be hell on earth for your actions you committed. I don't know what evil poisoned your heart and mind that caused you to murder my brother, Rand LaPazlaw. What deranged state of mind consumed you to murder your ex-wife, Jennifer Lannan, or Justin Mata, or Matthew Miller, or Michael Dabkowski? I do wish that New Mexico had the death penalty.

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The murderer deserves the death penalty. Sean committed horrible, deplorable acts. He said he did it for the sake of his children, but was he right? I don't know. This is a tough one. What I do know is this. If someone had harmed my kids, I would be pretty relentless in protecting them. Not sure if I'd murder someone, but you could probably push me there with enough trauma.

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I think a lot of parents would feel the same way. Sean loved his children, that much is undeniable. But the love became twisted. Into enabling Jen. Into endangering the very kids he wanted to protect. And finally into violence he couldn't take back. He saw horror. He carried trauma. And he became a monster in trying to fight monsters. I guess it's a good lesson for us all.

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I don't excuse what he did, but I also don't mourn every life he took. I can't feel sympathy for people who prey on children, or people who put their own children in danger. That's the tension in Sean's story. Love twisted into vengeance. Protection warped into destruction. And maybe the scariest part is this. Sean Lannan believed he was doing the right thing. Isn't that something?

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How often does that happen in society, when people who think they're doing the right thing are just misinformed or tricked by those with ulterior motives? You could do a lot of harm trying to do the quote-unquote right thing.

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I think what happened there was when he went to New Jersey, I think seeing those pictures of that situation might have triggered something to do with Mike, and it's like just one of those pictures out, you know, out of Mike's possession.

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