Turkey on trial: Can courts control a nation?

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The Documentary Podcast 31 min 3 speakers 8 chapters transcribed 4 hours ago
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How are Turkey’s courts being used to silence political dissent?

Unknown 0:00
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Carine Torbey 0:03
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Unknown 0:26
The documentary, home of the best documentaries from the BBC World Service.
Emily Wither 0:45
Thanks for choosing to listen to Assignment on the documentary podcast from the BBC World Service. I've worked as a correspondent covering Turkey for years and live in Istanbul. I've seen how the legal net is widening here. Opposition mayors, journalists and increasingly performers and entertainers are finding themselves on trial. The government insists its courts are simply applying the law and the judiciary is independent. But critics say President Erdogan is using the courtroom to silence dissent and tighten his grip after two decades in power. I've been investigating how Turkey's justice system came to work this way and what's left of freedom of speech.
Unknown 1:30
Oh my goodness, I cannot believe how many police there is. Is this normal? This is our normal. Can I ask why you came today? I'm Daria. I'm here to support Deniz and demand his release because it is actually illegal what they are doing to Deniz. It is not illegal to make jokes. It is not illegal to say what you believe. It is not illegal to make some jokes as a comedian.
Emily Wither 2:00
I'm outside Istanbul's main courthouse. It's a large multi-storey complex with a vast marble atrium connecting endless corridors. These days, it feels more like a prison, surrounded by metal barricades and a ring of police. I've come here a lot over the years, following court cases in Turkey, and the cast of people appearing keeps widening. Opposition mayors, students, and today, a popular comedian called Deniz Göktaş. They are chanting freedom
Unknown 2:34
for
Emily Wither 2:34
art, freedom for humour and freedom for Deniz. A month earlier, Deniz was on stage. He looks small at the front of an outdoor amphitheatre in Istanbul. He's dressed in black beside a giant model of his own severed head, backed by lavish red curtains. The 32-year-old pokes fun at Turkey's President Recep Tayyip Erdogan, who's ruled the country now for 23
Fletcher Christian 3:03
years.
Emily Wither 3:06
In one joke, Deniz compares Erdogan to a grumpy neighbour and describes how he's evolved from a shy dictator to one who is at peace with his own identity. For 90 minutes, he takes aim at everything. Society, religion, the jailed opposition, the kind of material that in today's Turkey gets you in trouble. He even laughs about that culture of fear. All was fine until his show was posted online. First, the authorities here tried to block clips of it, citing national security. It didn't stop it going viral. It had struck a nerve with Turkish society.
Unknown 3:43
Millions of people are completely disappointed, hopeless and sad. What's happening to the country? A sharp regime change, full of oppression. We are on a survival mode in our daily lives, struggling to pay our rents, pay our bills, to study. And Deniz Göktaş gives all our feelings and problems in his jokes. He spoke for a lot of what young people are feeling right now. Exactly, exactly. He became a symbol of the youth now.
Emily Wither 4:15
Not everyone found the jokes funny.

Why was comedian Deniz Göktaş arrested and what does his case reveal about free speech?

Emily Wither 4:17
Many found them outright offensive. And the chief prosecutor's office said hundreds of complaints were filed. I asked Daria, one of his supporters, about that.
Unknown 4:27
Yes, offensive joke, but it is joke. It was not insulting the religious people. It was not insulting the religion. It was not insulting the ordinary people's rights or beliefs. But I believe he's now in the court because he called Erdogan openly as authoritarian leader. That is the main case.
Emily Wither 4:59
When I saw the clips online, I got hold of his number and I sent Deniz a text asking him for an interview. I'm not sure he ever read it and I suspected there might not be much time anyway before he'd be arrested. I'm Emily Wither, and for Assignment, I'm in Turkey. I've been living and working in the country for years, and I've seen firsthand how the fight for this often polarised country's future is playing out in its courts. This is a story of three courtrooms recorded across one summer. I've covered hundreds of opposition politicians who are facing legal battles or are in jail here. And increasingly, it's not just the political opposition.

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