Christine Carbo’s Montana mysteries combine nerve-ending suspense with serious questions of the human heart – like whether frayed lives ever mend, or loneliness ever ends. Hi there, I’m your host Jenny Wheeler and today Christine talks about why the West is seen as a place of personal reinvention in the American psyche, and why she – like Steinbeck – “loves Montana. Six things you’ll learn from this Joys of Binge Reading episode: • How third grade shyness nearly sabotaged her dreams . . . • And Steven Spielberg’s (podcast) advice saved them • The West as a place of personal re-invention • Why ‘saying Yes’ helped her get started • The writers she admires most • And why unpublished writers should writing conferences Where to find Christine Carbo: Website: http://www.christinecarbo.com Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/christinecarboauthor/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/@christine_carbo Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/christine.carbo/ What follows is a “near as” transcript of our conversation, not word for word but pretty close to it, with links to important mentions. But now here’s Christine Jenny: Hello there Christine and welcome to the show, it’s great to have you with us… Christine: Thank you so much, it’s great to be on your show. Jenny: And just so readers are aware- you’re in Montana and I’m in Auckland- we’re linking across the globe! You’re entering fall now aren’t you – is it late summer or early fall? Christine: It’s still pretty hot- it’s late summer, there’s no signs of fall yet but it won’t be far away! I would say within 6 weeks, we’ll be starting to get into some fall. Jenny: Beginning at the beginning – was there a “Once Upon A Time” moment when you decided you wanted to write fiction? And if there was a catalyst, what was it? Montana suspense author Christine Carbo Christine: This is a difficult question for me, because I don’t remember any very specific kind of turning point. Once I heard this quote on a video by Stephen Spielberg, and he mentioned your dreams kind of whisper to you; they don’t push out to you, you just have to kind of listen. I don’t think I heard that whisper properly until I was in late high school, beginning college and there was a vague sense that I wanted to write a book, or a novel. I just kind of had these stories in my mind that I could kind of see in my head playing out. I had this notion that I wanted to write them down – they weren’t even short stories, they were long. I knew that if I ever did it, it’d have to be a novel. Yet I totally didn’t have the confidence to do that, I was not prepared to do that. I wasn’t even a huge, well read teenager at that point. I’m a little embarrassed to admit that, but I kind of had this approach avoidance thing with reading going on for a long time. When I was little, I was told in third grade that I couldn’t read, and they were thinking of holding me back because they thought I had trouble reading. I kind of did have a little trouble reading, but mostly it was shyness because in those days they would make you stand up and read in front of the whole class. It seemed like that was the way maths was done too- stand up and “what’s 8×7?” I would completely freeze. Well, the same thing would happen when they made me stand up and read in front of the whole class; I was just painfully shy. I couldn’t do it. So that was the barometer- can she read or not? And actually, I was able to read, and I was not that person they were seeing, I would just kind of get gun shy that I wouldn’t be able to do it. To cut a long story short, they didn’t hold me back but I think that little voice was always in my head saying “you can’t read, you can’t read, you can’t read,” and so I felt it was crazy – if you can’t read why would you think you can write? But the feeling of wanting to write persisted and I ended up getting a Masters degree in the English field – maybe to prove it to myself and that third grade teacher – so I made it happen, and then from there in my mid 20’s I decided to write a non genre novel. So I did – and I didn’t really do anything with it. And I wrote a second one, and again, I didn’t really do anything with it. And then I took a long break from writing which is another story….. The Wild Inside – Christine Carbo Jenny: I’m sure that story would be tremendously encouraging for people who have got that little voice whispering in their head but doubt their ability to produce a novel…. For people who are not so familiar with the terms, what would you see as a “non genre” novel? Christine: Back then when I wrote these two books – and it’s been a while because I went through a divorce and became a single Mom and I went into survival mode, so it’s been a while since I wrote those two books, but at that time – and it hasn’t changed that much – romance, sci fi and mystery and thrillers – those kinds of categories – are considered the genre novel although they certainly cross all sorts of boundaries – but the straight “slice of life” sort of book which doesn’t have any murders or so forth. Of course every book has to have conflict to keep it interesting, you want to know what happens to this character – so you really break it down – but the non genre work usually sits outside of those terms of romance, detective mystery or thriller and maybe is a little more literary. I used to call it another Oprah Book Club novel – in fact that was my dream. I was going to write this semi-literary Oprah type novel that she was going to pick… it didn’t happen!!! Jenny: Your series now – they probably are genre but they are extremely complex genre – they probably come into more than one category…. You’ve described the most recent one, A Sharp Solitude, published this year, as police procedural meets domestic suspense meets the wild.. So you are really handling several sub genres at once . .. Christine: Yes.. I have written four novels in the mystery genre – my fourth one I had a protagonist who had specialised skills… Anyone can be a sleuth, right, but she happened to be a local FBI agent who was qualified to handle the job of investigation, but she doesn’t get it because it was handled by an “ex” of her’s – not her husband, but he happens to be the father of her child and she is too close to it to investigate professionally so she works around the edges. So there is the police procedural element, but because she is very involved with it hence comes to domestic suspense… I tend to deal with characters who have pretty serious past trauma issues and so I get a little psychological with that, and go into their heads quite deeply and that pulls it out of being a ‘quick mystery’ series. Jenny: The four Glacier Mystery books are also described as an “ensemble” series… because you have a revolving door of lead characters – so someone who is introduced in a subsidiary role in one book gets their own lead role in the next book. And you have referenced Tana French and her Dublin murder series as giving you the idea to handle it this way – can you talk us through that process? Mortal Fall – Christine Carbo Christine: It really was a matter of “How can I fit another one in?” As I alluded to earlier, I took a ten year break from writing. My life fell apart a little bit, I decided I needed to take care of my little boy, I got into some technical writing, and it was very monotonous and I didn’t really have the interest or energy to write at the end of the day… and I was teaching at a local college – so when I came back to writing this whisper was loud enough to say – yes I was wrong. The voice got louder and it was saying ‘this is what you needed to do’ so when I came to terms with that I decided I don’t want to write another trainer novel that I just hope ends up on Oprah, I was very deliberate about it…. What I like to read includes a lot if crime fiction so I dug in and thought I’ am going to write crime fiction.’ But it wasn’t easy. I didn’t know anyone in criminal investigation, noone in my family for example was engaged in that field, so I had to do quite a lot of research and dive into it… A lot of people say they want to write books and I think sometimes we even roll our eyes at people who talk about it – like “Yeah, really do I want to spend my time with this person who says they want to write a book.. ?” but that was just in my head. Everyone I talked to was super nice and super helpful and they didn’t really care whether it came to fruition as a book or not, they helped me out with getting an understanding of law enforcement and I decided I was going to write a book set in my area so I could “write what I knew” so to speak. I live in Whitefish, Montana, which isn’t far from the Glacier National Park, I like books with a strong sense of place and setting, and I thought what better place than the park which is the “crown” of the parks here in the United States.. So crime fiction came first and then the setting next. Whitefish Montana – natural beauty Jenny: And you’ve been complimented on the very strong sense of place in the series… Everyone remarks on it…. Glacier National Park, in Montana, close to the Canadian border, is an important extra dimension. – a looming presence. You have been compared to writers like Cheryl Strayed and Wild, her book about walking the Appalachian Trail.. Do you get out in the park much yourself? Christine: It’s funny I have walked a ton in Glacier and other areas in Montana close to me, but there is so much I haven’t done yet, because there are so many places to go in the North West – like around Bozeman or Eastern Montana so those are ones I would probably prefer to do before hiking in California or Alaska. I have hiked in California, but I haven’t hiked any off the Appalachian.. Since writing has taken over, my hiking has been “drastically impacted.” I love the writing but some of the recreation has taken a back seat… Jenny: You’ve quoted John Steinbeck who said in “Travels with Charlie,” “I am in love with Montana. For other states I have admiration, respect, recognition, even some affection, but with Montana it is love…” What is it that sets Montana apart for you? Christine: Well you know the scenery is gorgeous where I live, it’s very beautiful, We are not very heavily populated, which might bug some people but some people love the fact we have less than a million people in a very big space, and you feel very close to nature… I guess it’s about lifestyle choices – I just met a guy the other day who had just moved here from Arizona and he said “I came, I saw, I wanted to stay.” I don’t know what exactly it is – a simpler life, not so much traffic, we have certainly got development going up like crazy way any touristy town does. I’ve seen it grow and develop since I have been here, but it’s not like being stuck on the subways or looking at concrete. You have freedom and schools feel relatively safe, although that could turn on a dime with the way things are in the State with the shootings. Jenny: There is another deeper theme in your work too and that’s – the West as a place of personal reinvention…. For you it’s been that? The Weight of Night – Christine Carbo Christine: So I moved to Montana with my family when I was in about eighth grade so I wasn’t really put into that place of personal reinvention… but perhaps it was like that for my parents – my family was in that spot. My dad had a really great job as chief of pathology in Gainesville, Florida, and he decided “let’s go West” – let’s leave the Florida heat and be in the mountains.. Montana became my home very quickly even though I missed the beaches.. I think for my Dad and Mum a little bit that thing of going West was about rediscovering themselves, and finding something fresh. I guess there is a Manifest Destiny element – ‘Go West and strike it rich and we will solve our economic problems..’ You know there are all these schools for troubled teens – my second book focuses on this a little bit – there are all these schools where kids – mainly from the East – will be sent – in Utah or Montana or Idaho – and they are literally wilderness schools where kids are taught to be more self sufficient – there are some good schools here but there are some bad ones as well.. Let’s face it, fresh air does not always solve drug problems for example! There is that myth still after so long, it is still this magical mysterious thing to “go West” to the mountains… My first book explores a family who moved out here and things go drastically wrong, and then in the second book, they send a kid to school and that goes drastically wrong.. I wanted to play with the idea a little bit – what happens when things go drastically wrong… when it doesn’t work out… Moving to a more general focus, away from specific books to your wider career Jenny: What’s one thing have you done perhaps more than any other, that is the secret of your success? Christine: You know I think the simple answer to that is “saying Yes” to things.. Like I said… You know I think I didn’t really answer your questions about the ensemble series – I got off on a tangent about Montana. But knowing nothing about the publishing world when I jumped back into it I did it the traditional way – I queried agents, and I bought the big directory full of the names of agents and sent queries to see if I can get someone interested in the manuscript. I didn’t know about crime fiction or mystery specialist conferences, and when I discovered this and in that, networking with people I got asked to do things – can you help out was this – and at first you think well I am a seasoned writer, you’ve written a novel and you think that’s going to be it. But you are really aren’t not after one book, there is still so much to learn. You get asked to write a short story, or an article, and it’s scary. You think ‘I don’t know I’ve never written a short story’ – its kind of scary but you have to say Yes I will do that. I will sit on that committee, I will take part in that panel, and so on and the more you say yes the more you will meet people, the more comfortable and easy it gets to participate. You have to fight that urge to block this stuff off… Jenny: Those are fighting words from someone who said they were shy as a little girl. It sounds like you have really combated that in later life. Christine: Yes, I have. Even teaching helped. I taught English classes at a community college for years and that really helped me as well, having to speak my mind on committees helped me overcome it… Turning to Christine as reader Jenny: The series is called “The Joys of Binge Reading” because I see it as providing inspiration for people who like to read series . . . .And series really are the “coming thing” as you’re proving So – turning to your taste in fiction who do you “binge read” ? And do you have a current series or author – or more than one – you’d like to recommend to listeners? Christine: Really great question. I read all the time, but almost because I am in this business, I have strayed away from binge reading – you go to conferences and you meet twenty people who want you to read their book, or you want to because you’ve met them and you find them interesting – so it makes it much harder to sit down and read 20 books from the same author… It is a little chaotic – I have books everywhere, and I end up reading a ton – but some of it can be the debut author, not so much series. But I read everything that Tana French puts out. I love the darkness of Mo Hayder, I love Laura Lippman, Megan Abbot, Elizabeth George. James Ziskin, who you had on the show, I love his series as well, so there are people if a new book comes out, I will read them, but if I am way behind, if there is a series out with fifteen books, I can’t do that. Laura Lippman – ‘female noir’ And then another author whose name I would like to throw out, who is maybe not as well known as Tana French or Elizabeth George, and that’s Mark Stevens. He has got a series set in the Colorado Rockies, the Alison Coil Mystery series and I will always read his new books. Circling back to the beginning at the end (I see this as a bit of a narrative) Jenny: At this stage in your career, if you were doing it all again, what would you change – if anything? Christine: I was so green when I got into it, if I had known more about it, if could have gone to some of the conferences say three years before I got published. I think it’s really great to have that networking in place a little bit before you publish, that’s a tip for writers who want to break in – you can go to the conferences long before you get a publishing contract… but I would like to finish my story though about Tana French and the idea of an ensemble series…!! When I went to New York to meet two editors who had made offers on my first book, The Wild Inside, I was thinking ‘my gosh I hope I get a contract and my book will be in book stores’ – and I wasn’t thinking about ‘the next and the next.’ So one of these editors said to me “So what’s next?” and because my book had this magnificent Grizzly bear in it, and she was really hooked on that bear – so it was “what’s next and what animal are you going to have next?” And I am thinking ‘I don’t want to have another animal,’ but in my mind I am also thinking ‘I don’t want to blow this’ and so I say “Ummmm wolverines?” I just threw it out there and my next book had this element of a wolverine researcher who goes missing and elements of the school thing and I was able to pluck a side character from there – yes it did happen after the fact and it worked for Tana French because you feel like you are reading stand alones and yet you are in the same world as well. I also like to write stand alones because you can play through the whole character arc, and yet I like being in a familiar world too – so they work on two levels. Jenny: That’s a great story about the bear. . . and it leads very well to one of our last questions and that is ‘What is next for Christine the writer now?'” Christine: Well you know, as I’ve said the ensemble thing works well, but occasionally you run into a glitch, where you have an idea which doesn’t fit. Then you think ‘Okay I’m going to break that formula.’ So now I am working on a story with a new character who hasn’t appeared in other books. I am also working on a short story for an anthology on Montana spaces – and here we are back to that “Say Yes” thing. I’m at a point where of how I continue forward with it, is still up in the air. It might evolve into a stand alone work, or it may stay with the Montana series, I’m still working it out. Jenny: That sounds great. We are coming to an end of our time, so where can readers find you on line? Are you active on social media? Christine: Yes I am and I can be found in all the usual places . . Website: http://www.christinecarbo.com Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/christinecarboauthor/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/@christine_carbo Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/christine.carbo/ Jenny: Thank you so much for your time, Christine, it’s been great talking to you. Christine: Oh thanks for the really great questions, I’ve enjoyed it,… Thanks To Our Technical Support: The Joys of Binge Reading podcast is put together with wonderful technical help from Dan Cotton at DC Audio Services. Dan is an experienced sound and video engineer who’s ready and available to help you with your next project… Seek him out at [email protected] or Phone + 64 – 21979539. He’s fast, takes pride in getting it right, and lovely to work with. Our voice overs are done by Abe Raffills, and Abe’s another gem. He got 20 years of experience on both sides of the camera/microphone as a cameraman/director and also voice artist and television presenter. Abe’s vocal delivery is both light hearted and warm and he is super easy to work with no matter the job. You’ll find him at [email protected]

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