Brooke van Velden: Internal Affairs Minister says she has no confidence in Fire and Emergency boss Kerry Gregory
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Why did Internal Affairs Minister Brooke van Velden say she has no confidence in Fire and Emergency CEO Kerry Gregory?
How bad does fire and emergency look, eh? How hopeless are they? Select Committee slammed them yesterday. Then the Minister tells us she's got no confidence in the CEO. The claim is he withheld information from her for over a year. It pertains to levies. The matter's now in front of the SFO. Minister Brooke Van Velden's with us. Good morning. Good morning, Mike.
What powers does the minister have and why can’t she simply sack the CEO?
Just explain the rules and regulations here. Why don't you just sack them all? What's this no confidence thing? Just go and sack them all, can't you?
I don't actually have power to do that, Mike. Under the law, that would be a breach of the Crown Entities Act. What I can do, though, is express no confidence. And it's now a matter for the board to determine what to do from here to restore my confidence. But it's a pretty significant issue. You know, it goes to the heart of accountability and transparency in public service, where we've had a Crown entity
How is the board being refreshed and who did the minister appoint to it?
breach their own law and decide they don't need to let the minister know even when they've received advice saying you need to let the minister know still actively with how that information from me and how can i hold that agency accountable if i don't know the details and i think it is despicable
couldn't agree more how many on the board did you appoint
So I have appointed all of them on the board. We've been doing a bit of a refresh. There is a new board chair at the moment who I think is doing a fantastic job. And he is the reason how I know this information. Unfortunately, it's been more difficult than I thought to replace some people on the board. So there's currently a vacancy because the names that I had put forward for the new spot were not of a caliber that I thought was sufficient for the organization.
But the reason for my question is if you've appointed the whole board, Why haven't they gone ahead of you and gone, Brooke, this guy's an idiot and we're letting him go?
Well, my understanding is that they were not aware of this issue until quite recently.
Why does the minister say the board’s lack of knowledge shows a competence problem?
Well, is that much
of a board then?
Well, if they've been actively held without information, then that's an issue too. But the more important point here is the new board chair is going to be meeting with the board immediately to restore my confidence. But there's an issue at play here. There's always been issues with fire and emergency. We've always known that. Lots of historic issues, payroll, the fleet procurement, asset management. But at least when I've known about it, I've been able to actively hold them accountable to their plans and processes. And we have actually seen some progress. This was active withholding of information.
Does the Crown Entities Act limit accountability and should the law be changed?
And I think it reeks of people thinking they're above the law.
Indeed. What is it about FENS? Because as you say, it's been going on for years in various different guises. What is it about FENS in and of itself that's so uniquely hopeless?
Well, I've asked my officials specifically that question, which is, is it because it is a Crown entity so at arm's length from government ministers that they are essentially a law unto themselves? And so I've asked for some immediate advice on whether or not there does need to be a better change to the law to allow for better accountability. Is it the fact that it is a Crown entity that is leading to these widespread cultural issues at play?
Interesting. Have a good weekend, Brooke Van Velden, Minister for Internal Affairs.
What broader issues of transparency and culture does the minister highlight in public service?
I'd be worried about the board. If the board didn't know, then is that a competent board? If you've appointed the board and the board doesn't know and the board aren't ahead of you, What sort of board is that? And that goes to, once again, I reiterate the poll that came out yesterday on this bloke, Blake Leard-Emby, who was misleading people left, right and centre, and nobody seems to get sacked. There appears to be this complete disconnect between the real world and the public service, or Wellington and the rest of the country. They seem to think differently, act differently, behave differently, and there appear to be no consequences.
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Chapters
6 chapters
1
Why did Internal Affairs Minister Brooke van Velden say she has no confidence in Fire and Emergency CEO Kerry Gregory?
0:00–0:17
2
What powers does the minister have and why can’t she simply sack the CEO?
0:17–0:46
3
How is the board being refreshed and who did the minister appoint to it?
0:46–1:50
4
Why does the minister say the board’s lack of knowledge shows a competence problem?
1:50–2:26
5
Does the Crown Entities Act limit accountability and should the law be changed?
2:26–3:10
6
What broader issues of transparency and culture does the minister highlight in public service?
3:10–3:48
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