Shane Jones: Associate Energy Minister on the Government's $1.2 billion gas transition loan scheme for businesses
episodeTranscript
jump: chapters · speakers · find in transcriptTranscript
Transcript generated automatically by AI and may contain errors.
What is the government's $1.2 billion gas transition loan scheme for businesses?
The energy transition story rolls on for business with this new $1.2 billion government underwrite basically for gas users to move on to something more renewable or reliable. 80% of the loans got the government backing. The banks are offering apparently a decent deal. Shane Jones, Associate Minister of Energy, is back with us. Very good morning to you. Hey, morning folks. What's your risk profile on the amount of money you may end up coughing up? Ideally it's zero, isn't it?
Yeah, but I think Nicola said she put aside something like $50 million. That Treasury reckon we could lose, whether or not it goes up or down. I mean, whether or not $1.2 billion is enough depends on what the uptake is. Some might go on to LPG.
How are businesses expected to transition away from natural gas?
Some might go on to electricity. It depends whether or not the local lines company can cope with the uptake and the surge in electricity. I think some might go on to coal, and I really don't care.
Are the banks playing ball on this? Are they good corporate citizens in this?
You know as well as I do the Aussie-owned banks prefer housing. I mean that's why the Aussie banks have set up a special fund between the government and the banks over in Australia to try and overcome the deficit of lending to small businesses in Australia. Perhaps it's something we'll look at in New Zealand. But look, I don't want to exaggerate how many firms might take it up, but God knows there are a lot of firms. They have been caught unawares, I think, about the precipitous decline in gas. I think one thing that really does bloody annoy me, though, Mike, is that There's a level of revelry and almost sort of a moral gleefulness in the minds of my green opponents that gas has declined so precipitously.
These are our fellow Kiwis.
These are firms that have been caught on the hop. Exactly, and these are businesses we want to do well and pay tax and fund all the stuff that they would like to pay for. I'm assuming they've not joined those two dots.
Yeah, yeah, well, we know that, and I'll have more to say about that on Thursday in the budget speeches.
So is there an argument at all, despite what you've just said, that this has been coming, they should have known it's been coming, and they can probably take care of it themselves, or are we doing the right thing by small business in particular?
I just think we're at a point in the arc of the nation's growth, mate. Unless the Crown steps up, it's not to get any fun. But it's a dynamic situation. Unless the Crown steps up, a lot of these firms are going to go by the way. I mean, there's the pet food crowd there in Taumarunui. Their options are pretty dire. And I think it's fair to say this is the least risky approach. We can outsource the due diligence to the banks. The banks have worked with Treasury, to the best of my knowledge. Geothermal for a number, like there's a firm called Essity. I think they make cardboard something in Kawaroa. They can go to geothermal energy. There are some problem children, for example, the Whakatane Mill. I think there may be a need for some bespoke solutions.
But, you know, there's in the top 10 users of gas, there's 3,800, 4,000 Kiwis employed there. The gas is dropping precipitously. In another five years, we're down to 50 petajoules. We're continuing to look for gas with the $200 million that we've got on tap. But the reality is electricity is expensive. This is an option. Other countries are doing it. Don't for a moment think that everyone's going to transition to electricity. There are other options. There's biomass.
What role do banks play in supporting the gas transition?
And indeed, if some want to go to coal...
then Shane Jones, King Cole, is going to support them.
Nice to talk to you. Shane Jones, Associate Minister of Energy.
No segments match your search.
Select any passage to copy it with its citation or turn it into a shareable card.
Chapters
3 chaptersSpeakers
2 identifiedMore from The Mike Hosking Breakfast
Mark the Week: Supermarkets have become the obsession of the campaign
Mike's Minute: Council amalgamation – something else this Govt didn't deliver
Richard Arnold: US Correspondent on the meeting between Trump and Xi, return of the White House press pool
Wrapping the Week with Kate Hawkesby and Tim Wilson: Critiquing Mike, school holidays, ageing
Full Show Podcast: 25 September 2026
Chris Medland: Formula 1 Journalist on Liam Lawson's return to Racing Bulls, the Azerbaijan Grand Prix