The Neuron: AI Explained
Mustafa Suleyman on Seemingly Conscious AI and Microsoft's Next Chapter
24 Sep 2025
Microsoft AI CEO Mustafa Suleyman (co-founder of DeepMind) joins The Neuron to discuss his provocative essay on "Seemingly Conscious AI" and why machines that mimic consciousness pose unprecedented risks - even when they're not actually alive. We explore how 700 million people are already using AI as life coaches, Microsoft's massive $208B revenue strategy for AI, and exclusive features like Copilot Vision that can see everything you see in real-time.Key topics:• Why AI consciousness is an illusion - and why that's dangerous • Microsoft's 2 gigawatt datacenter expansion (2.5x Seattle's power usage)• MAI-1 Preview breaking into the top 10 models globally• The future of AI browsers and autonomous agents• Why granting AI rights could threaten humanitySubscribe to The Neuron newsletter (580,000+ readers): https://theneuron.aiResources mentioned:• Mustafa's essay "Seemingly Conscious AI Is Coming" https://mustafa-suleyman.ai/seemingly...• Try Copilot Vision: https://copilot.microsoft.com• Microsoft Edge AI features: https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/edge• MAI-1 Preview models: https://microsoft.ai/news/two-new-in-...Special thanks to today's sponsor, Wispr Flow: https://wisprflow.ai/neuron
Full Episode
There is nothing inside. It is hollow. They don't have a pain network. These models are going to arrive. They're going to be as good as humans at most tasks in the next three to ten years. Adding a new class of rights to these beings would really threaten and kind of undermine our own species. It's really going to change the way that we use computers forever.
Meow! Meow!
Welcome, humans, to The Neuron Explained. I'm Corey Knowles, joined, as always, by Grant Harvey.
Today, we are tackling one of the most interesting ideas in AI right now. What happens when machines start to seem conscious, even if they're not?
Our guest today is at the center of this debate. Mustafa Suleiman is the CEO of Microsoft AI, co-founder of DeepMind and author of The Coming Wave. His recent essay, Seemingly Conscious AI is Coming, raises urgent questions about the risks of building systems that can mimic the texture of consciousness and pull on our empathy without ever actually being alive. Mustafa, welcome to The Neuron.
It's a pleasure to meet you, sir.
Thanks, Corey. Thanks, Grant. Great to be here. Thanks for having me.
Yeah, yeah. So in your essay, you argued that AI will actually mimic consciousness in ways that trigger human empathy, even though there is no inner experience. Could you elaborate on what you think the risk of that is and why we should worry about it?
Yeah, I mean, maybe sort of let's start by talking about what these language models are doing, because I think it's important for everybody to try to grasp a pretty simple intuition, which is that
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