The New Yorker Radio Hour
Elissa Slotkin to Fellow-Democrats: “Speak in Plain English”
Fri, 9 May 2025
When Elissa Slotkin narrowly won her Senate seat in Michigan last fall, she was one of only four Democratic senators to claim victory in a state that voted for Donald Trump. It made other Democrats take note: since then, the Party has turned to her as someone who can bridge the red state–blue state divide. In March, Slotkin delivered the Democrats’ rebuttal to Trump’s speech before Congress, and she’s been making headlines for criticizing her own party’s attempts to rein in the President and the Republican Party. She thinks Democrats need to start projecting “alpha energy,” that identity politics “needs to go the way of the dodo,” and that Democrats should drop the word “oligarchy” from their vocabulary entirely.Slotkin prides herself on her bipartisanship, and she believes that Democrats must use old-school collegial collaboration in Congress. And, as different Democratic leaders have appeared on The New Yorker Radio Hour in the past few months, discussing what the next four years might have in store, Slotkin tells David Remnick about a different path forward.
Chapter 1: What challenges did Alyssa Slotkin face winning her Senate seat?
When Alyssa Slotkin narrowly won her Senate seat in Michigan last fall, she was one of four Democratic senators to claim victory in states that also voted for President Trump. And it made other Democrats sit up and take some notice. Since then, the party has turned to her as someone who can bridge the red-blue divide.
She delivered the Democratic Party's response to Trump's speech before Congress back in March. And so the party is putting Slotkin front and center. But she's also giving the Democrats a dose of tough love. She thinks that they need to start projecting what she calls alpha energy.
She said identity politics needs to go the way of the dodo and that Democrats should drop the word oligarchy from their playbook. Senator Slotkin prides herself on bipartisanship. She believes that finding a path forward for the Democrats absolutely demands old school collaboration in Congress.
For me, as someone who's new to this body, 30 days in this body, I will always seek to work where I can with my colleagues, but not at the expense of the fundamental freedoms and our democracy. That may not be politically palatable back home, but I don't care. Because if we can't do it, what is the point?
What is the point of being senior elected leaders in this body if you don't stand up for the country that you love? There's no king in this country. There's an elected president. Please stand up on behalf of your country.
I spoke to Alyssa Slotkin last week. Senator, you won the Michigan Senate seat in a state that voted for Donald Trump. And given your own track record, what do you think those voters saw in both you and the person they voted for for president?
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Chapter 2: What does 'alpha energy' mean in politics?
Well, you know, I think the way that I've boiled it down is basically two things. Number one, I focused pretty religiously on economic issues. I mean, the vast majority of my TV ads and my mailers and my digital stuff was about pocketbook issues in one way or another.
And I think there was a question about Democrats in general and what their priorities were and if their priorities were actually like lowering costs. And then the second thing is a little bit more ephemeral. It's harder to grab. And that's just kind of an alpha energy thing, right?
I mean, I think people are looking for leadership and to sort of lead through the dark tunnel into the light of a very complicated time in our country's history. And so they want a little alpha. And that's not a male-female thing. That's just a leadership thing. And I obviously have major disagreements with the way Trump leads, but I don't think most people would deny he's got alpha energy.
Chapter 3: How should Democrats address economic issues?
Chapter 4: Why does Slotkin believe Democrats should avoid identity politics?
I mean, I think people are looking for leadership and to sort of lead through the dark tunnel into the light of a very complicated time in our country's history. And so they want a little alpha. And that's not a male-female thing. That's just a leadership thing. And I obviously have major disagreements with the way Trump leads, but I don't think most people would deny he's got alpha energy.
And for me, especially going into communities, you know, in order to win and represent my state, I got to go into very conservative, very red areas, very Republican areas. My whole strategy is lose better in red areas, right?
Go in and meet enough people and surprise enough people that you peel away some of those voters and you lose better, you know, with 41 percent of the vote instead of 35 percent of the vote in a certain county or an area. And I think part of that is it's not about your policy papers that you write on your website. It's not about wonky stuff. It's just like, do they get the leadership vibe from you?
And I think I had a few more ounces of that than maybe the average Democrat. And it helped me in some of those areas where Democrats kind of lost pretty big.
Just to be clear, and not to make a stereotype of anybody's position... It's what you're saying that if you stray from issues like high prices, just economic issues, bread and butter issues, that if you start talking about democracy, if you start talking about oligarchy or all the other issues or even corruption when it comes to Donald Trump, that in a place like Michigan, you're going to fail.
Well, I think you have like we can walk and chew gum. Right. Like I think there is no way I would ever say with what Donald Trump is doing to roll back our democracy that we shouldn't be watching those issues and activated on those issues. We should. I mean, you know, as someone who's been in national service my whole life, like that's what we're trying to do here is preserve our democracy. Right.
But I think if you're only doing that and not speaking to people who are really struggling to pay their bills, you're just having half a conversation. In Michigan in general, if you're not talking about the economy, you are literally having half a conversation. And I've had someone say to me, like, I can't pay for my kid to go to summer camp with democracy. Right.
So it's not that people don't care. They do. But if you're working two jobs and have crappy health insurance, like it's just not the thing that's keeping you up at night. And so I have made this very plain that Democrats can do more than one thing. But in my part of the world, you've got to speak from people's pocketbooks and their kids as a first place.
Do you think that Kamala Harris failed to address economic issues?
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Chapter 5: What are the sacred cows in American politics?
Yeah. So for example, to me, I think we need to be honest that while many regulations, right, are done from goodness, right? We want to protect our environment. We want to protect public health. We want to, when you overlap, 20 different regulations so that it becomes impossible to get a permit to build a manufacturing site for 15 years. Then we've lost the forest for the trees, right?
So I am 100% willing to have a real conversation about peeling back regulation. I don't want to hurt the environment or all these other things that we care about, but my farmers... They've been like responsible, good actors for 25 years, right? They get evaluated on how they climb ladders. I'm like, what do you do it ass backwards? Like how do you go up a ladder?
What I'm seeing is we have over-regulated to the point of not being able to get our dollars out. And look, I think about this for things that are very much like important democratic agenda items that we've gotten in our own way by making so many rules and regulations that you can't actually move quickly and show that democracy and government can work.
So regulation or over-regulation is one sacred cow that needs slaughtering in your view. What other sacred cows should be brought to the butcher?
So let's take one that's fundamental to who we are as Americans, immigration. Everyone knows our immigration policy is broken. Is there a single person in this country who thinks our immigration system is working? It's not working for the immigrants. It's not working for employers. It's not working for the economy.
We need more, actually, immigrants in order for our economy to be completely unleashed. We need a legal vetted way to get people in. For years, people have been talking about comprehensive immigration reform, right? That we can't do a deal, Democrats and Republicans, unless we get everything.
And in fairness, there was a bill that was sunk by the Republican Party.
I mean, 100 percent. Right. Everybody, everybody has blame to go around. Right. On this issue. My thing is like, you know what? It's so broken. I'll take incremental immigration reform. I will take I don't have to make it all work out in a perfect plan. I will just double the caps of every legal visa category today.
And I'll work with anybody who's willing to do that because we need more legal vetted immigrants coming here, working here, building their lives here. And to me, like that's that is controversial. I'm going to get some emails about that statement. OK, right. But I think we need to be willing to say that not everything can be perfect in this world.
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Chapter 6: How does Alyssa Slotkin propose to change immigration policy?
Chapter 7: What is the importance of bipartisanship for Slotkin?
I spoke to Alyssa Slotkin last week. Senator, you won the Michigan Senate seat in a state that voted for Donald Trump. And given your own track record, what do you think those voters saw in both you and the person they voted for for president?
Well, you know, I think the way that I've boiled it down is basically two things. Number one, I focused pretty religiously on economic issues. I mean, the vast majority of my TV ads and my mailers and my digital stuff was about pocketbook issues in one way or another.
And I think there was a question about Democrats in general and what their priorities were and if their priorities were actually like lowering costs. And then the second thing is a little bit more ephemeral. It's harder to grab. And that's just kind of an alpha energy thing, right?
I mean, I think people are looking for leadership and to sort of lead through the dark tunnel into the light of a very complicated time in our country's history. And so they want a little alpha. And that's not a male-female thing. That's just a leadership thing. And I obviously have major disagreements with the way Trump leads, but I don't think most people would deny he's got alpha energy.
And for me, especially going into communities, you know, in order to win and represent my state, I got to go into very conservative, very red areas, very Republican areas. My whole strategy is lose better in red areas, right?
Go in and meet enough people and surprise enough people that you peel away some of those voters and you lose better, you know, with 41 percent of the vote instead of 35 percent of the vote in a certain county or an area. And I think part of that is it's not about your policy papers that you write on your website. It's not about wonky stuff. It's just like, do they get the leadership vibe from you?
And I think I had a few more ounces of that than maybe the average Democrat. And it helped me in some of those areas where Democrats kind of lost pretty big.
Just to be clear, and not to make a stereotype of anybody's position... It's what you're saying that if you stray from issues like high prices, just economic issues, bread and butter issues, that if you start talking about democracy, if you start talking about oligarchy or all the other issues or even corruption when it comes to Donald Trump, that in a place like Michigan, you're going to fail.
Well, I think you have like we can walk and chew gum. Right. Like I think there is no way I would ever say with what Donald Trump is doing to roll back our democracy that we shouldn't be watching those issues and activated on those issues. We should. I mean, you know, as someone who's been in national service my whole life, like that's what we're trying to do here is preserve our democracy. Right.
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Chapter 8: Why does Slotkin argue against the term 'oligarchy'?
I'm speaking with freshman Senator Alyssa Slotkin of Michigan. This is the New Yorker Radio Hour with more to come.
A lot of times, big economic forces show up in our lives in small ways.
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But the price has gone up, so now I only buy one. Small but important ways. From tech billionaires to the bond market to, yeah, banana pudding. If it's happening in business, our new podcast is on it. I'm Max Chastin.
And I'm Stacey Vanek-Smith. So listen to Everybody's Business on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
This is the New Yorker Radio Hour. I'm David Remnick, and I've been speaking today with Senator Alyssa Slotkin, a Democrat of Michigan. Now, the word oligarchy describes the concentration of political power by the ultra-wealthy. Many Democrats these days are using the term to critique how Donald Trump has transformed Washington, not to mention the influence of Elon Musk.
But Alyssa Slotkin has taken issue with the term. We'll continue our conversation now. Senator, your fellow Democrats, Bernie Sanders and Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, are now on a national tour called the Fighting Oligarchy Tour, and it's drawing big crowds in the tens of thousands. And you have said at the same time that Democrats ought to stop using the word oligarchy. Why?
What's your difference, either in style or opinion, with that?
Yeah, it was literally just the word. My dad asked me what it meant, and then a bunch of other people Ask me what it meant. That's it. It's just a word. Like, just say we have no king or whatever you want to say. But I think actually it says a lot more about the state of the Democratic Party that we are arguing about a word.
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