The Reform UK Podcast
EP 7 - David vs Goliath in Makerfield - Act I: Reform’s Plumber Puts Spanner in Labour’s Plans
24 May 2026
Transcript generated automatically by AI and may contain errors.
Chapter 1: What triggered the Makerfield by-election?
We will teach Starmer a lesson next May that British political history will never forget. Don't underestimate that. Well, he can't say he wasn't warned.
A dark day for Labour.
Reform up by an extraordinary rate. Labour down. Labour wiped out. The PM clinging on and reform surging all across the nation. Nigel Farage is going to be the next Prime Minister.
Even Andrew Marr got the message. As Nigel Farage predicted last September, May 7th was a sobering day for the Prime Minister. I feel it. After years of open borders, broken promises and demonising their views, surprise, surprise, working people were no longer voting Labour. The fallout was immediate and brutal. Dozens of Labour MPs, nearly 100, called for Keir Starmer to resign.
The scores on the doors, 88 MPs thus far have come out against the Prime Minister. Health Secretary Wes Streeting quit the Cabinet, declaring he'd lost confidence in the PM.
We need a proper contest with the best candidates on the field and I'll be standing.
And in Makerfield, Josh Simons, elected less than two years ago, announced he was stepping down.
If I had voted for Josh, I would be thinking, saying to myself, hold on a second, I didn't vote for Andy Burnham.
It was all part of a crafty plan to anoint a new king. But Reform had a real local candidate, and he'd brought his van. But this time's different. This time we've got a real chance of winning. And if we can win, we can make a difference. I'm Ray Addison, host of the Reform UK podcast, and this is Act 1 of the Makerfield by-election, David versus Goliath. Hello, just a quick favour to ask.
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Chapter 2: How is Andy Burnham involved in the Makerfield by-election?
Morning, everyone. Thank you so very much for making it all the way up to Mayfield. This is an absolute, enormous thanks from all of us that you've come here today. The entire point of today is canvassing.
When Josh Simons resigned on May 14th, it triggered a by-election in his Makerfield constituency, a proud working class heartland of red brick terraces and former mill towns just south of Wigan. Seeing a route to number 10, Andy Burnham, Labour's mayor of Greater Manchester, pulled on his tight running shorts and declared that he would stand. But reform were already on the move.
Less than 48 hours after Simon's announcement, activists were out canvassing.
Look at this. The team's getting bigger and bigger. Are we going to do it? I think we've got a real chance in this baseball, Joe. This is going to be one of the most historic by-elections ever, and we're going to throw the kitchen sink at it.
I joined the team at 10am on Sunday 17th May. Reform had yet to announce their candidate, but deputy leader Richard Tice was in Makerfield motivating the troops. Those of you who thought we were going to have a rest after the local elections, we've got news for you. We're kicking on again.
This is absolutely extraordinary, a momentous moment in political history, because what happens on June the 18th will define what happens to the Labour Party, to this government and actually probably the timing of the next general election. So the next four weeks is a huge, huge effort. And what a constituency to have this contest. 24 out of 25 wards voted Reform just 10 days ago.
They have sent us an extra bit of a bonus. Makefield voted 65% to leave. And West Streeting and Burnham, they basically both want to rejoin the EU. They're essentially saying, up yours, the good voters of Makefield. And wouldn't it be fantastic to send a message that actually Andy Burnham is not the King of the North. Reform, we are the King of the North.
Out on the streets of Ashton and Hindley, neat rows of red brick semis stand shoulder to shoulder under a beautiful cloudless sky. The smell of Sunday roasts drifts from kitchen windows as volunteers tramp up garden paths, past hanging baskets and fluttering Union and St George flags. Lee, a newly elected local councillor, told me a bit more about the area and the voters.
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Chapter 3: What strategies is Reform UK using to campaign in Makerfield?
Well, it's been Labour officially since 83, but it predates that by quite a long way. You know, we're talking not long after the First World War. It's never really been anything but Labour. And in essence, it's been a victim of Manchester's success. So the city centre's got this wonderful Manhattan skyline, whilst it's towns around it, the town centres are shutting down.
The high streets are closing. There's litter on the streets. You know, they just haven't spent any time focusing on the peripherals. What's the character, the nature of the people? The core is your solid, working class, backbone, backbone of the country, completely.
I know it's said over and over again, but it couldn't be any truer of the people of the whole borough, you know, whether it's Wigan, Makefield, Lee and Atherton, the salt of the earth you know we've come from mining backgrounds you know a lot of people have worked at Heinz after the pits have been closed and very much salt of the earth
Further down the road, Richard was chatting to a homeowner on their doorstep. You with us? Your mate's with us? Yeah, I am, yeah. Thank you very much. Well, we're doing amazingly. We're getting a great response already.
Excellent. I mean, people don't want labour and they don't want Burnham. He's done nothing for... Well, nobody's here. I used to have an old camper van. Right. And I had to get rid of it because of what Burnham brought in because of all this clean air. All that clean air stuff, yeah.
And then he bottled it, having wasted 100 million quid of... Sign's still up, camera's still up, yeah.
Well, you know what we'll do? They'll reintroduce it.
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Chapter 4: What challenges does Labour face in Makerfield?
Ridiculous. 100%, yeah. So do you do a postal vote or do you go to the polling station? We go to the polling station. So remember the photo ID? Yeah, definitely. Nice to see you. Thanks a lot. Appreciate it. Tell your mates. You're on, mate.
I'm Ray with the Reform podcast. Why are you voting Reform?
Because I want change, mate. I don't like the way things are going at the moment. They're stereotyped as the far right when we're not. We're just genuine people who are concerned for our own. Our daughter's going on the streets. Our wife's going on the streets. She don't know what's going to happen.
How do you feel then when you see a statement made by the Prime Minister ahead of that Unite the Kingdom march, where people are talking about the far right?
All I can say about him is you wouldn't see Keir Stander walking around just on his own, would you? You wouldn't see him walking anywhere on his own. Whereas you see Richard, he's just been here, shut my hand outside my own doorstep. Fair play to the man, yeah? At least he's out doing it, yeah?
As we walked from door to door, support for reform felt strong. What's your views on Burnham? Do you think he would have a chance here?
In my opinion, no, because, I mean, we was always brought up to be laid back.
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Chapter 5: How do local voters perceive Andy Burnham?
We always, all my family and everything, but over the last few years, they don't stand for the working class anymore. I think reform have not got a problem. I think they're going to take over it easily.
Some people are saying that the Burnham effect might have an impact here.
No, I don't think so. Labour used to be a working class party, didn't it? But that's not the case anymore.
Hi, guys.
Yeah, we're canvassing for the by-election that's just been announced.
Lovely to meet you.
Nice to see you.
How are you? Yeah, great, thank you.
Yeah, you with us?
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Chapter 6: What are the sentiments of traditional Labour voters in Makerfield?
And I think we've got obviously close links to Greater Manchester. We are Greater Manchester and I think he has done some good things. So I think it is going to be a bit of a challenge. But fingers crossed, hopefully the right candidate and we'll get the vote.
How many doors do you reckon you've knocked on in your political career so far? It's the first knock to count. It's funny where sometimes you can be doing a long session and you end up getting tongue-tied.
You sort of almost forget how you get so, particularly as you sort of get nearer the date, you know, 10 days to go, three days to go.
I always, when I started out, you know, used to be sort of a bit nervous the first few doors, but now actually, and it's just the awareness is so remarkable. Have you had any awkward moments? Oh, plenty. And what's really important is A, to enjoy it, but B... Hi there, so yeah, we're canvassing for the by-election.
Are you going to be voting?
Felt like a no. So I would put that as an against. Yep, you can't please everybody. Later that afternoon, I headed into Ashton in Makerfield Town Centre, the beating heart of the constituency, to see what shoppers thought about the by-election. I have no feelings on it. No, no particular strong view? No faith in any of them. Really? Yeah.
Would you mind me asking how historically you might have voted in the past?
At Labour. I'd prefer Reform, I think.
I don't agree with Reform. You don't like Reform? Which party do you traditionally vote for?
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Chapter 7: How does Rob Kenyon plan to make a difference in Makerfield?
I've not voted for years. I wouldn't know who to vote for. You're not the first person to say that to me around here. Do you think that's a common feeling? I think so, yeah. A lot of my friends are the same. I used to be a strong Labour man. All I can think about is Andy Burnham and the cars. Cleaner's zone. What feeling has that given you? To be quite honest, a lack of trust, that's it.
How do you feel about Reform UK?
Yeah, they've got some good ideas. When I had voted, it tended to be Tory, but I don't know who I'd vote for this time.
Would you consider reform or no? No.
Why not? You know, I believe in free trade and immigration movement.
Free movement of everybody.
Yeah. I did economics at university, so that's my view.
How do you work out the economics if you don't know how many people are coming? Just wondering whether I could ask how you feel about the by-election? I think Reform's got it. Right to hilt. Yeah, definitely. I'm 62-year-old. I've always voted Labour.
But honestly, I'm just so disillusioned to how Storm has gone against the working class and the British people that there's no excuse for him being like that. He was voted to represent the working class and he's let everybody down.
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Chapter 8: What is the significance of the upcoming by-election for Reform UK?
The biggest thing he's let down is himself, but the main thing, the country. The next day I was back in London to meet Reforms MP for Runcorn and Helsby, Sarah Pochin, who knows exactly how much every single vote matters after winning her seat last year by just six votes.
It's brutal. Do not put yourself forward, particularly for a by-election, if you are not prepared to put your life on hold, your family on hold, your husband, wife, whatever, on hold. The best thing about it was I lost a stone in weight. I've been trying to lose a stone in weight for 20 years. Oh, perfect, by-election. You don't get time to eat. And so that was a bit of a result.
Win or lose, I was happy I'd lost a stone. It becomes an addiction. Every day you get up, you just can't wait to get back there. But also you have to be that person that wants to knock on doors. I love knocking on doors. Even the ones that get pushed in your face. But you've got to love people. Don't do this if you're a career politician.
Don't do this if you don't really want to change people's lives. That's what I would say to candidates.
As it builds towards polling day in that by-election, what should the candidate be feeling, experiencing on the doorstep? Is there a change? Is there a momentum that you kind of feel like you're getting into like a flow or a zone?
Till the very last moment, you feel, I felt privileged to stand, let alone to win. Don't take anything for granted. Never, ever think you're going to win until you actually win. But... You have to be strong, you have to be brave. The media will chuck everything at you, but of course you have to be sure of what you're doing.
What's your take on the fact that Andy, this guy, stood down to give him potentially a seat to then challenge the Labour leader at the moment, Keir Starmer? And what do you think his chances are?
For me personally, what do I think of Andy Burnham? I think of him as the person that has betrayed the grooming gang's victims, the rape gang victims. That's still going on. When he had the opportunity to hold people in authority to account for overlooking, for not challenging those rape gangs, he didn't do anything about it. He sat on it. And personally, I can't forgive him for that.
And I think there have been an awful lot of people up there that can't forgive him. That area is ground zero for grooming gangs.
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