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Chapter 1: What is the main topic discussed in this episode?
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With powerful psychoactive effects believed to heal many ailments.
It's wildly effective to cure depression, PTSD, or trauma.
It just transports you to an entirely different reality. There were moments where I really felt like I was flirting with madness. It's so powerful. Like there's a reason why it's called the Mount Everest of psychedelics. I felt so vulnerable and open and loving. And it was just, it was really profound for me.
Some of these moments have been the most beautiful moments that I've seen with you. You feel like not the old you. You feel evolved.
It's been the greatest gift that I could give myself. Am I changed? Maybe. So you ready to talk about this?
Am I ready? Are you ready to talk about it? I'm just here as your compassionate witness to hear all about your journey.
I don't know if I'm ready to talk about it, but I'm going to talk about it.
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Chapter 2: What led to the decision to try iboga therapy?
There's lots of things that I do. There's lots of modalities that I've availed myself of. And I still run into blocks.
Chapter 3: What is the significance of the iboga plant in healing?
Despite all of that, I still am stuck in recursive patterns of behavior that don't serve me. I'm still mired in resentments over things that happened in early childhood. And I'm still victim to a negative inner monologue.
In my own process of spiritual seeking and transformation, I have not used psychedelics. However, in your case, for a being that is wired the way you are, I did see the potential benefit in it. And so I was supportive of you exploring this journey.
your support is the most important piece in this. Like I'm not gonna run off and do this unless you're kind of in my corner as an advocate of this. So that's a really important aspect of this. And yes, I'm not sharing this because I'm advocating it for anybody else. I'm not a mental health professional. I'm not somebody who has all that much experience in the world of psychedelics.
I'm here to just share my experience in the hope that perhaps it's helpful to another person, but please do not be under the impression that I'm advising anybody to do this. These are very powerful compounds. And when they're in the wrong hands or administered to the wrong person at the wrong time, it's gonna be a cross purposes with the intention of them being helpful. So caution is advised.
Please consult mental health professionals before even beginning to entertain this as being something that you should or shouldn't do. With that being said, it was very difficult at times. There were moments where I really felt like I was flirting with madness, that I was locked in a padded room, and that my entire life was a projection in the mind of an insane person.
There were those moments of simultaneous death and birth. And that was scary. It was scary. It was like, am I ever gonna return to my body? Do I even exist outside of a mental projection? Perhaps my entire life is something I've purely imagined.
And I did have that experience in the aftermath of looking at the books in this woman's library, realizing so many of them had been written by people who have been on the podcast and thinking,
like that scene at the end of the usual suspects, when you look up at the board and like all of that stuff is, you know, the whole mystery is revealed that, uh, that my life was a complete fabrication and that I had never not been in that library looking at those books. And I'd only imagined this existence where I hosted a podcast and actually had relationships with these people.
Yeah.
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Chapter 4: How did the iboga ceremony unfold?
It was the most beautiful drawing, like magnetism to this woman. And she really embodied a beautiful, feminine, mother, gorgeous frequency. That's the most I can say. And I was sitting at dinner, and there was a man who was sharing his success with plant journeys, and he's a sober individual. And as I said, I'm not an advocate for plant journeys. It's not my standard.
But out of curiosity, I said, so you found it very transcendent. And I said, would you tell me about that? And he said, well, I've taken all of many, many, many, many plant medicines, ayahuasca, all these other things. And he said, but this experience that I had literally changed my life forever in the best way. And he said, iboga. And I said, so with iboga.
And he said, specifically iboga with her experience. and he pointed to the woman that I had been drawn to. So I came home, we exchanged numbers, and we became close, and we chatted on the phone for an hour and shared all our spiritual experiences, and I knew she was quite versed with the root.
She had gone to the country of origin and met the indigenous and worked with them, and she specifically talked about that she worked with the feminine aspect of the plant, where in sort of
I'd say clinical formats it was her opinion or what I understood is that they're actually only working with part of it and it's the masculine part of it so I came home and I said I'm not interested in plant medicine ceremonies but if she was having one tomorrow I would go like that that is what I felt so I wanted you to connect with her because I said I may have found the woman for you the one that could hold you in this space
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Chapter 5: What were the challenges faced during the iboga experience?
But I realized I had a few totems in my backpack. So I called you and I was like, I have this and I have this and I have this. What should I do? And I had this walnut that That I remembered you gave me and you were giving out. I think we were having a party and you gave them out to people. But I couldn't remember the context of it.
Do you remember now? I forgot.
And then you told me on the phone and then I forgot again.
I facilitated a fire ceremony during which a feminine being came out of the fire. So a being in the fire and those were the walnuts that were the prasad of that fire ceremony.
So I would say- The point of the walnut is-
The point of the walnut is that this walnut is activated with your truest intention, your truest heart intention. That is, the fire witnesses it, and it's the group in the community that then adds energy to it. So the fire is seen beyond worlds, so it's opening to the stars, to the celestial realms. And so the walnut holds the totality of the fire that was lit that night.
And you're supposed to keep it very, very preciously and only eat it or offer it at a very potent time. So I would say that you were completely prepared and that there was great intention behind that. And just because you're Your personality didn't prepare. You were definitely prepared.
Well, that's good to know because the walnut was what I had and the walnut is what I offered.
It's kind of amazing.
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Chapter 6: How does the divine feminine play a role in the healing process?
I'm not always looking for the exit or the way out of an experience. My foot isn't always tapping. I don't have the same sense of urgency. There's just a general feeling of greater calm and an appreciation, I think, of what's really important. Things like joy and gratitude, while not my constant companions, I feel like are more accessible to me and a little bit less fleeting.
But I think the best sort of metaphor is that it doesn't feel like I'm walking around with a backpack full of rocks all the time. Like I've set the backpack down and I pick it back up and I'll walk around with it But then I'll realize like, oh, I don't need to walk around with this and I'll put it back down again. I think that's the best way of describing it.
But again, that's my interior experience. And more important to me is how I'm showing up for you and for other people. So you're the arbiter of like whether or not this has had any impact on me in a positive or my behavior in a positive way.
It's been profound in many ways, incredible. Like in one aspect, one perspective, you feel reborn. You feel like not you, like not the old you. You feel evolved. And I've had a few experiences with you that are literally the first I've ever experienced being your partner of over 25 years. We were talking about it, and what it is is it's in your presence.
So what I identified it as is that the old you, even in a condition of helping me, you came with that backpack of resentment, of being put upon, of I don't really have the time to do this, I don't really want to do this, I wish she was smarter about this, why isn't she smarter, why doesn't she know, all these kind of things.
And even though you wouldn't say that ever, and I think like many women, we can feel about many levers of energy that's very readily available to us. So I always felt that separation. And we did a couple mundane things together. And it was shocking to me because we don't do any mundane things together. I said, I'm going to the car wash, and you said, I'll come with you.
Just that statement, I'll come with you to the car wash. That was already, I was like, whoa, he'll come with me. So we went, and then you chose the wrong car wash. You directed me out of where I was going and had me go to the specific car wash that was completely swamped. And then after we got trapped in the line, we discovered they don't clean the inside of the car. They only clean the outside.
And the old you would have been completely incensed, especially if I had chosen the car wash to go to, but you had chosen it. So that helped. But we just went through it and you were just present. And then we got out and we just vacuumed the car out. Like we each had a hose and we were vacuuming this car out. And then we went to get some food.
And you looked at my post and you said, can I look at your phone? And I said, yes. And you took it and you said, you know, I wouldn't do this like this. I would change it. Could I change it? Is that okay with you? And you changed it and you reposted it. And then we went to the movies and we were lying in the reclining seats and your face was so close to mine. And you were...
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Chapter 7: What insights were gained about personal transformation?
And I felt like, oh, my goodness, what if we don't have enough time together? And I had never felt like that about you. And so it is simply in the presence. It's not what you do, what you achieve, what you get, what you grab, what you present as. It is the resonant tone of the presence that the feminine is desiring in the deepest part of her heart.
And that is a shift that I think gives us hope as a couple that have been together for 25 years of what is the evolution that is possible. Like it's profound. And we both feel this. It's as if I feel we're on this spiral of time. Like we started off and in the young days that we were together, we were creating things.
We were raising our children and making art and music and movies, and you and I were writing together, and we were doing many things together. And then the life got big, and it separated us by the things you were achieving that overarching drive, right? Just took over.
And now I feel like the spiral has come around and we've been given the blessing of this awareness and this opportunity of a next evolution of creation. It almost feels as if the timeline has folded on top of each other. And now we get to begin again with all this history. And so thank you for being open, for having the courage. It's a Herculean thing that you did twice already. It's not easy.
So thank you for doing that and for being open and to being available on the journey to continue to explore. And I don't think it's meant to be... transformed all in one go. I think it's a journey. It's a journey of discovery. And it doesn't have to be all or nothing all the time. It just has to be cherished, revered, honored as really the most important thing.
Yeah, I think one of the things that has weighed on me in the aftermath is the, the weight of expectations. It's sort of like, okay, I'm going to go do this.
But if I come out of this and I'm not like, like quote unquote, like fixed and I'm still me and, and I'm not like living up to whatever like expectations I've placed on myself or you have placed on me, like, well, he's going to go do this and this is going to like solve this problem. And we're going to, it's going to improve our marriage. And if I don't
show up for that or I can't live up to that, then either the experience failed me or I'm failing the experience and by extension failing you and everybody else.
I get it. But I guess maybe that's a lens that you're looking at it still as an achievement.
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