Show notes
Allen, Joel, Rosemary, and Yolanda discuss Modvion's €39M grant for wooden wind turbine towers, leading to a discussion about funding vs. engineering readiness in the wind industry. Plus they highlight Veolia's blade recycling advances in PES Wind Magazine. And the Weather Guard team announces they'll be in Edinburgh for the ORE Catapult Offshore Wind Supply Chain Spotlight!
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Allen Hall: A portion of the Weather Guard team. We're headed to Scotland for the ORE Catapult Offshore Wind Supply Chain Spotlight, which is gonna happen on December 11th in Edinburgh. We're gonna attend that and it's gonna be a, a number of great offshore companies there. We're hoping to interview a couple of them while we're there.
But Joel, this is a real opportunity, uh, for offshore companies in the UK to showcase what they can do and they can get on the Uptime Wind Energy Podcast.
Joel Saxum: Of course. So we're flying over the sixth and seventh there over the weekend. And we will be, uh, in Edinburgh, uh, on the eighth. So Monday morning through Thursday.
Thursday and Thursday is the or E Catapult event. And yeah, we're excited to see some of the companies that are gonna be there, interview some of them, get the, the picture, uh, of the uk um, supply chain, right? Because I think it's a really cool event that they're doing. I'd love to see other countries do that.
I'd love to see the US do that. Um. Just say like, Hey, this is, these are the companies, the up and [00:01:00] comers and the, the people that are changing the game and, and kinda give them a platform to speak on. So we're excited to do that. It's gonna be a one day event. Um, love to see some people join us, but the other side of that thing is we're gonna be over in Scotland.
So we're, well, we've got a couple meetings in Glasgow, a couple meetings in Borough. So if you are around the area, um, of course we're linking up people on the uptime network, but, uh. If you're around the area and you want to, you wanna chat anything wind, or maybe you got lightning protection problems, get ahold of us.
'cause we'll be over there and, uh, happy to drop in and uh, share coffee with you.
Allen Hall: It's just part of Weather Guards and the Uptime Wind Energy Podcast outreach to the world. So we're gonna be in Scotland for an entire week. We're heading down to Melbourne, Australia for probably a couple of weeks while we're down that way.
And we will be somewhere near you over the next year probably. It's a really good, uh, free service that we provide, is we want to highlight those businesses and those new technology ideas that need a little bit of exposure to grow. And that's what the Uptime podcast is here to do. So join us [00:02:00] and if you want to reach out to us, you can reach us via LinkedIn, Allen Hall, Joel Saxon.
We'll respond to you and hopefully we can meet you in
Speaker 3: Edinburgh. You're listening to the Uptime Wind Energy Podcast, brought to you by build turbines.com. Learn, train, and be a part of the Clean Energy Revolution. Visit build turbines.com today. Now here's your hosts, Alan Hall, Joel Saxon, Phil Totaro, and Rosemary Barnes.
Allen Hall: Welcome to the Uptime Wind Energy Podcast. I'm your host, Alan Hall in the Queen city of Charlotte, North Carolina. Soon, the home of Maersk North America, I think we're going to find out. And also the new Home of Scout, if you haven't seen the little, what was formerly a MC little vehicle that's gonna be made, well engineered in Charlotte and then built in South Carolina.
So we're looking forward to that. And with me as Yolanda Pone in Texas. Joel Saxons up in the great state of Wisconsin and Rosemary [00:03:00] Barnes is back in Australia. And there's plenty of things to talk about this week, and I, I think our pre-recording discussion has centered on wooden wind turbines. And if everybody's been following, um, mod Vion, they have received a 39.1 million Euro grant and they are making of all things.
Wooden wind towers. So, uh, up in Sweden, there's plenty of wood to make towers out of, out of it. And it's a laminated process. And if, if you've looked online, I encourage everybody to go look online. It's kind of an interesting technology they have where they're layering wood together to build these towers sections.
And so instead of using steel or other materials, concrete, you can make them outta wood. Uh, so the European Union is backing this, and as Joel has pointed out. This is not the only money they have received to develop this technology.
Joel Saxum: Yeah. Back in 2020, they received a six [00:04:00] and a half million euro. Grant as well.
And then they had some investment money come in, um, and it was in Swedish Knox. Okay. Or of course they're in Sweden, so Makes sense. But that was a, a convertible note around 11, 12 million, uh, euros as well. So when you add this 39 million Euro grant on, you're looking at about 55, 50 7 million euros in funding over the last five or six years for this company.
Allen Hall: How does the European Union decide where to invest? These innovation funds at,
Rosemary Barnes: you know, it's interesting 'cause I visited MO when I was in Sweden a few months ago. I actually have a video, uh, about to come out hopefully next week. Um, about, yeah, I got a tour of their factory and, uh, interviewed one of their engineers who's been with them like the whole time.
Um, and I visited them just a few days after I visited C 12. I made a video about that as well. That's a floating vertical axis wind turbine. C 12, just like four days after I visited them, they, um, received the [00:05:00] news that they had been awarded a similarly sized European grant. So, yeah, in the tens of millions, I can't remember the exact number.
And I was thinking, what would I do if I got, you know, 40 million euros, which is like nearly 80 million, I think Australian dollars. Like I could really come up with something major and develop it in that time. It's not, they haven't been given the money to come up with the right solution, right? They've been given the money for the solution that they already have.
And I think that it's really interesting that these European grants, it's set up like that where they're supporting, uh, assume that they've got a certain technology readiness level that you have to be at before that they will support you. And that kind of means that you're locked in to a solution by the time that you're at that point, right?
Rewards only that kind of model where you have a charismatic person with a vision that they just pursue to the end. It does not reward getting the smart people who could find solutions to the real problems. It [00:06:00] doesn't reward that because you, no one's getting heaps of money, like $10 million early on to be like, here's a problem, now find a solution and we're going to.
Fund that through the 10 things that you try that don't end up working, no one is funding that, right? So all of that has to be done on the basis of your own pockets or the ability of your charisma to convince other people to support it. And I just think that it's probably like. Not the right way to spend your, you know, if you've got like $500 million to spend to get the next big thing in wind energy, you shouldn't be picking a bunch of companies that are tier L five.
You should be getting the smartest people and giving them money to found a company and um, yeah, come up with solutions that way.
Joel Saxum: Is it wooden? Wind turbine tower worth it.
Rosemary Barnes: And ev everyone will have to have to watch my video. 'cause I asked, I asked quite in depth questions 'cause I went into it very, very skeptical thinking that this was a su sustainability play.
And I've got two issues with that. Like, first of all, wind turbine tower is [00:07:00] not that unsustainable. I mean, wind turbines on average are paying back the energy that it took to make them in, you know, six months or so. But what was interesting is, you know, wood is a, a composite material, right? It's got the, um.
Fibers, cellulose fibers in a malignant matrix. It's, it's, it's a composite material, just like fiberglass is. Why don't we make fiberglass towers? I mean, it's partly 'cause of the cost and it's partly 'cause joining them is quite tricky as well. Um, and yeah, those are probably the, the main two things, but I've actually done a bit of work into it.
If you could make a fiberglass tower, you could go. Way, way taller than you can with, with a steel tower, with, you know, transport constraints and whatever. So the wooden tower actually has a lot of the advantages that you would find if you had, were able to make a fiberglass tower. So they are expecting to be able to go taller, um, with, you know, they're as constrained by transport because, you know, the fibers are all running this way.
It's fine to cut it, um, like longitudinally, um, slice it into pieces and join the all site. Doesn't, um, [00:08:00] reduce the, the. The strength really. So there from that point of view, there's something to it. If you can go taller, make it easier to go taller with towers, then that's a real problem that needs a solution.
There are other solutions. There's like NARA Lift, you know the one just got bought by Ford Spanish company where they build a turbine on like a tiny tower and then slot pieces in underneath it to come up.