Sandrine Dixson-Declève is Co-President of The Club of Rome (LinkedIn, Twitter, Wikipedia). She divides her time between leading The Club of Rome, advising, lecturing, and facilitating difficult conversations. She currently Chairs the European Commission, Expert Group on Economic and Societal Impact of Research & Innovation (ESIR) and sits on the European Commissions Mission on Climate Change & Adaptation.We speak a lot about the latest findings of systems dynamics modelling as expressed in the book Sandrine co-authored, Earth for All: A Survival Guide for Humanity.The major finding is the need to address inequality and poverty, in order to avoid a graver social backlash and to make action on environmental challenges easier politically.This is a reversal of many environmentalists over the last decades, who have said: yes, inequality is important, but if we don't address climate change first then any improverments in poverty will be wiped out anyway.Sandrine turning that logic around: the only way to have an environmental transition is to have a just transition.The other finding in Earth for All is that all this can and must be done through economic growth, just a growth decoupled from impact. Sandrine explains how from 22:29.LinksClub of RomeMore on Jay Wright Forrester, pioneering systems scientist at MIT, here and builder of the first World Dynamics modelling which fed into the Limits to Growth report.Earth4All is a vibrant collective of, co-convened by The Club of Rome, and builds on the legacies of The Limits to Growth and the Planetary Boundaries frameworks. In effect the website, background papers and book are the 50 year update to the Limits to Growth report.Amitav Ghosh's The Nutmeg's CurseMore on Inflation Reduction Act, or 'IRA', here.More on Amartya Sen's claim on democracy and famines here.The red dotted-line of GDP still grows in the Giant Leap scenario:This diagram: Callegari B., Stoknes P.E., People and Planet: 21st- century sustainable population scenarios and possible living standards within planetary boundaries. Earth4All, March 2023, version 1.0. EU Expert group on the economic and societal impact of research and innovation (ESIR) here.I have now put the chapter from the unpublished book on my website here. It explores 'security through protection' vs 'security through renewal'.More links hereTwitter: Powerful_TimesWebsite hub: here.Please do like and subscribe, to help others find the podcast.Thank you for listening! -- David

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