Alex Wagner

You bring up gender, and I want to talk a little bit because you're a feminist about one of the things that fueled Trump's rise, which is the manosphere.

That's like red-pilled men who blame women for not only their own problems, but society's problems at large.

Is the manosphere something new?

Do you think, I mean, yeah, like I have two boys and I'm constantly thinking like, oh God, is the manosphere the natural extension?

Like, are they going to get subsumed by it?

So we talk about feelings a lot.

We get off the screens a lot.

I mean, I just think what is the way that society or women or whoever wants to take the mantle upon themselves to – how do you combat the manosphere?

It feels – I mean, I don't want to be unduly emphatic about its importance, but it does feel like –

A real thing, a real development, even if its essence is not new, the construct of this entire online sort of world subsuming young men and sort of radicalizing them in a conservative direction seems like something that, like, progressives and Democrats and people...

who care about empathy need to sort of like unpack and maybe figure out how to unwind.

And I guess I totally understand the notion of reconnecting to people and encouraging conversation and community and all of the rest.

But I wonder if you think there's anything more explicit that like, I don't know, our leaders need to do or we as members of society need to think about.

Apparently, we need to do a lot more.

Well, then let's talk about women, because you are a feminist.

And I wonder how you think of that concept in the Trump years, how it's changed and what being a feminist demands.

I mean... You don't have to answer.

But that's, you know, can I just say that in these times requires a degree of like connection to your own humanity and cultivating empathy.

You know, like you giving a shit about the men in the manosphere, at least, you know, sort of objectively requires a certain, you know.

a connection to the outcomes of your fellow humans or an investment in your humanity.