Alex Wagner

I keep talking about that.

Yeah.

Right.

It's not just trying to minimize the power and terror of ICE.

It's also trying to strengthen the resolve and resilience of the community itself.

Yeah.

You mentioned they're not trained.

And that, I think, is like something that is quite clearly, it's obvious when you look at these videos.

ProPublica has some essential, really urgent reporting this week about ICE agents using banned chokeholds on American citizens.

And I would assume that, you know, because that is explicitly banned in the DHS policy guidebook or whatever it's officially called, does that then make it easier for those families and those victims to take their case against ICE to court?

I know we're going to get into the difficulty of civil suits with federal agents in a second, but just using explicitly banned policies

Maneuver seems like it opens up a portal that maybe doesn't always exist.

Yeah, I mean, we're going to get to J.D.

Vance's assertion that ICE has absolute immunity.

But I do, you know, like I do wonder when you see these people being abducted and detained and arrested and violently thrown to the ground in establishments like the one I'm talking about, the chokehold video that is part of the ProPublica reporting happens in a restaurant supply store.

A lot of this stuff happens right around or actually inside businesses.

And I wonder from a legal standpoint, whether business owners have more agency in preventing ICE from acting so aggressively or maybe stopping the raid entirely.

I mean, how would that how does what what can happen in that space?

Sure.

Another thing that they can do... And just to stop you for one second, often ICE doesn't have warrants, right?