Alistair Campbell

And the pictures that were put out were of Ben-Gavir taunting them, abusing them.

They were made to kneel.

They had their foreheads on the ground.

And he was basically laughing at them, frankly, for being activists.

you know, you've had hostages that have been used by states.

But I think you're right.

I think this is more synonymous of a kind of non-state state actor.

Ben Gavir has got a track record of, he says he's really, really proud that he's basically brought in a regime of effectively brutality in the prisons.

It was a horrible thing I read recently about, you know, rape inside prisons has been used as a kind of weapon against some of these guys.

And also, although Netanyahu, as you say, has rebuked publicly Ben-Gavir on a couple of occasions, on that specific thing, he basically said that he did not criticize what was the evidence, the people involved in the evidence that was produced.

In fact, he called them heroes, didn't he, at one point?

He did, he did, he did.

And this one, you've got to go some...

as Ben-Gavir to have both Netanyahu and the American ambassador to Israel, Mike Huckabee, who basically is one of those, let Israel do whatever the hell it wants, it seems to me.

He called Ben-Gavir's actions despicable.

So what does Ben-Gavir conclude?

I don't know.

He concludes he can carry on.

But I was looking at the law, and again, back to one of our central themes, does international humanitarian law mean anything anymore?

But it says those involved in the transport and distribution of relief,