Alistair Campbell

They've threatened Mark Carney over his trade deal with China.

You see, I would argue that the coalition of the willing, so-called, in relation to Ukraine, which Keir Starmer has played a pretty leading role in, that is a form of the new sort of politics that Carney's talking about.

I think middle powers could do something very interesting and very soft power focused and

in replacing and undoing the damage that Trump has done by scrapping USAID.

Now, we're not in a strong position on that because we've cut aid as well.

But if you think about some of those middle powers I mentioned, France, Germany, Japan, Korea, Australia, Canada, UK, coming together and saying, we are going to try to fix the damage that has been done by USAID vacating the field.

What I thought was really clever about the way that Carney handled himself last week and in China, he didn't even talk about Trump.

He just talked about this is a new world and we have to address it.

We know what the context is, but I think there's lots of ways, I think in energy, I think in cyber, I think in misinformation and disinformation.

These right-wing autocratic networks of which Trump is now the sort of head, they operate together, they operate as a team, they pump out the same messages in the same way, they use the technology in the same way.

The progressive side of life, they've got to form alliances to do that as well as the right do it.

And what it means, by the way, I know they're sorry to keep going about Carney, but I really did think he was impressive last week.

Somebody pointed out to him that since he'd become prime minister, he'd spent 60% of his time traveling.

Okay.

Now here we have never hear care, right?

That's what they call it.

Mark Carney was challenged about that.

And he said, you know what?

I should probably be traveling even more because this is where leadership lies now.

This is where countries have to engage with each other.