Andrew Revkin

as I said earlier, you can parse it right down to the whole menu of things Joe Manchin wanted, you know, transmission lines.

Now we're going to have big fights over transmission lines.

We've got billions of dollars to spend expanding America's grid.

And every community in America is going to say, not here.

So how do you foster a federal, local dialogue that allows that to happen if you want to have any hope of a better grid?

So that's like,

Those insights come from behavioral sciences that I think are completely undervalued in this area.

Doing one thing together.

And there's an amazing video clip that shows this so powerfully.

2015 was the buildup to the Paris talks that led to the Paris agreement, you know, this and a really talented journalist at CNN at the time, John Sutter, who's from Oklahoma originally.

He, um,

He saw another Yale study that was a county-by-county study of American attitudes on global warming, like right down to the county level.

And there's this little glowing data point in Woodward County, Oklahoma.

Woodward County, Oklahoma was ground zero for climate skepticism, climate denial, whatever you want to call it.

And he thought, oh, I'm going to go there.

He went there just to meet people on the street, talk to them about energy and weather and

And he did these little interviews, and there's this one with this guy who's like a middle-aged oil company employee, like an administrator, Thai kind of guy.

And he starts out the interview and the guy is saying like, well, you know, God controls the environment.

And if you're watching this, you're just going, okay, this is gonna be interesting.

And the backstory, by the way, is the guy, he paid for the local playground to have dinosaurs and people, like toy dinosaurs and people at the playground, because he believes in creation, you know, 6,000-year creation.