Annabel

Some of them kind of looked out to the audience and kind of throw you the occasional glance.

She was like... And I found her exactly like she was in her books, which are terrific.

I really liked Becoming.

I thought that she...

she makes a point of being kind of frank, particularly about her relationships and stuff.

But I asked her at one point about, because I think that her second novel, The Light We Carry, a novel memoir, is sort of like it's more open about the

you know, stresses and issues she's had in her marriage.

And I thought it was unusual for a very, very, very famous person to err more towards disclosure as they, you know, go through life.

It's really unusual.

although she's obviously quite good at sort of drawing boundaries and keeping space for herself, and she said something so interesting.

It was that she was really worried.

She saw like this bit of a trend of younger people going like, oh, you know, Barack and Michelle, couple goals, et cetera, and she's like, no, babes, that's not couple goals.

Like it's just as crappy as it is in any other marriage, you know.

Yeah.

She said something like, you know, we've been married for 30 years and about a third of them have been awful.

which is pretty good batting average.

And I thought it was a great, like a great act of generosity to kind of

kind of put that out there as a contextualiser in this sort of age of making your life look perfect on Instagram or whatever.

I really like that about her.

Like the thing that really struck me about her first memoir, Becoming, which like starts with her childhood, is her level of recall about detail in her childhood is like unbelievable.