Dan Pfeiffer

Cause she was, she was trailing by a lot at the time.

So it's like, what do you have to lose?

That's that is the I mean, can you imagine what the Democratic presidential primary is going to be like in that situation?

Like I was even thinking back to the 04 primary.

which you worked on for John Kerry.

Yeah, I did.

But I just remember there was, like, this bidding war of, like...

people saying Bush was the worst president ever.

And people kept saying it like in stronger language.

I think at some point Dick Gephardt may have swore, but like this time it's going to be like, someone will say, fuck Trump.

It's going to be like, mother fuck Trump.

Just like mother fuck Trump and everyone he's ever been with.

It's just going to get like up and up and up.

Do you worry as we look at the primary that there's this incentive, which is, fuck Trump.

And I don't mean just like Trump is bad, but like a literal message of the equivalent of this is like, fuck Trump, is a great way to get attention and raise money and maybe even get some support in a Democratic primary.

And so you have the short-term incentive to do those things, but it has potentially long-term consequences both for party branding and the general election for whoever wins the nomination.

Yeah, we don't know the calendar yet.

And I think they have to figure it out by the end of this year.

But

It's almost certainly going to be a more expensive endeavor than it's ever been before because you're going to have some larger states at the front.