Daniel Ek

So one way to frame it instead would be podcasting is ad-supported audio and audiobooks is paid audio.

So for you guys, I mean, I also happen to know you spent so much time and effort on the research of that site.

You could imagine that in the future you have the ad-supported side of your podcast be certain types of episodes and you'd have for your subscribers the unlock where they get access to these kind of deep dives

And obviously the subscription thing could be as simple as like, hey, you're part of our other network and it doesn't cost money, or you could paygate it all the way through.

But I think it's more of a business model that's the big format differentiation.

Because as we said, like the quality, the mics we're using relative to an audiobook, there's no difference here.

You're using like high quality camera equipment.

Also very similar to more professional style than sort of do-it-yourself kind of equipment.

Editing, all these things, it's getting more and more blurred.

Yeah, which is so interesting.

Yeah, and obviously our view is we eventually think audiobooks should be much, much larger than what it is today.

Hundreds of millions of people who are actually listening to audiobooks because the content is great rather than today what's tens of millions of people.

Yeah, we believe it's like tens of millions.

It's one of the fastest growing categories, which makes it interesting.

But it's, again, fundamentally, it's both a business model problem.

It's, you know, again, a discovery problem and all those other things.

Exactly.

You guys are exactly right.

And there probably needs to exist a different business model for all of these things.

But you could even, in your case, I mean, you guys have probably right now a pretty defined audience, I would guess, and probably a very high value audience, which makes ad supported monetization possible.