Dr. Ciara Kelly

Exactly.

And people do.

Or they've stayed single all their lives.

And not acted on it and been alone because they...

weren't maybe comfortable or brave enough or whatever the word is, and I don't mean to use any pejorative word, they're like brave, that might sound pejorative, but that they lived alone rather than living with someone because they wanted to be accepted.

So that meant being alone.

And I think that's quite heartbreaking, to be honest.

Why would she love you more?

My mother used to say, which is actually terrible when you think about what it would set up in terms of the psyche, I love you more when you're sick.

There's a great... There's an incentive to walk around with like Munchausen's or something.

Do you know what I mean?

It didn't work on me, but you know what I mean.

And so sick is a really positive... There are people who embrace... This is a separate podcast entirely, but there are people who embrace the sick role.

because of the secondary gain they get from the sick role.

So you have to be very careful.

I was a doctor for many, many years.

You've got to be very careful about the secondary gains.

What did I, did I?

Careful.

Be very careful.