Dr. Emma Shortis

And so, of course, any de-escalation is welcome and should be welcomed by the government.

But...

At the same time, you know, this government is doubling down on its alliance with the Trump administration.

And so it's exposing those kinds of contradictions as well.

Contradictions that aren't limited to Australia, but exist across especially democracies, you know, and democracies that like to talk about the value and the importance of the international rules-based order, even in the face of Trump's assault on that order.