Ethan Evans

And the big example was he would tolerate debate.

I had a manager, a vice president, who was arguing with Jeff about something.

And the CFO, because it was going on and on a little bit, stepped in and said, Jeff, do you want me to shut this down?

Like right in front of my boss.

Basically, do you want me to tell him to shut up so that you don't have to?

And Jeff said, no.

This is how we learn.

And they went, you know, six more rounds.

Of course, Jeff still won because he's the CEO, but he explained his logic and defended it.

And that later that day, I heard other leaders broadcasting that example of you wouldn't believe what happened today.

You know, Jeff agreed to go extra rounds with his VP because he said, this is what I want.

I want people who will push back.

Those examples spread.

That's actually what I would call good gossip.

That storytelling of, look, the leader is for real.

The leader really does want this.

So that's how I think you get rid of political correctness is you have to live it and you have to get your leaders to live it.

And then if they live it, it will die.

The temptation to be afraid to say anything and we have to be super inclusive and bring everybody into a big group hug.

I don't want to exclude anyone, but I also don't have time to come around and, you know, sort of politely say, do you have anything to add?