Gordon Carrera

I could see you quite late last night.

I was up late.

Yeah.

You were later than I was.

Thank you for joining us.

Last question, any current recommendations of favorite spy books, films?

Interesting.

That's the Michael Fassbender one.

Okay, very good.

Very good.

Well, thank you.

I'm going to let you both go back to the conference, to hard work, networking, doing what journalists do, maybe have a drink, drinking gin and tonics maybe later.

Shane and Sean, thanks very much.

Thanks.

I said there was no David on this podcast.

That's kind of not true though, because we've got a different David.

I found another David who was an intelligence analyst, and even more to David McCloskey's annoyance, he was actually in the DIA, the Defense Intelligence Agency.

His name is David Kapler.

He was a US intelligence analyst, but then became assistant secretary general of NATO in charge of intelligence and security.

including in the run-up to Russia's invasion of Ukraine in 2022, where he was quite involved in briefing people.