Jack Clark

You're never going to have the money.

You're never going to have the talent.

This is never going to work.

And how do the governments get the money to pay people in a competitive rate if they can all go off and work at Silicon Valley for much more money?

Okay.

Well, Jack, the problem that we've got is that AC is not the United Nations of which Demis Vassavis dreamt in this interview that he gave to you.

It's...

Effectively voluntary, right?

And it's the UK government.

And the UK government is not the US government.

It's not the Chinese government.

One of the things, you're right that when you're being optimistic, you say, isn't it lovely that US and China discussed AI safety?

Actually, if you look at that summit, what's shocking is how little Xi Jinping and Donald Trump discussed AI safety.

That's 50% of the world's economy.

Those are the two countries that have all the foundation models that matter in the whole world sitting in them.

and they're not really doing it.

And so it doesn't, I think, ultimately really matter if plucky little Britain gets on and pushes ahead with its stuff if 50% of the global economy is not playing ball.

Give us examples of some of those bigger risks that would need something bigger.

So let's just dig into one of them, which might raise bioweapons.

Yes.