Jake Ducey

And, um, so it's, it's really, it's helped me out, but I can understand why people want to do it totally independent.

What was his or her name?

His name is Bill Gladstone.

He runs Waterside Productions.

Bill Gladstone, Waterside Productions.

No, no, I didn't hire him.

We thought we were going to get a traditional publisher was the thing, and then we couldn't, so we had to self-publish.

Balboa and these companies, for anyone listening, it's disheartening to see the self-publishing packages that are 3,900 and you get 10 books.

They rip you off.

I mean, I recommend either going...

Amazon, or, you know, there are routes that you can do it for a couple hundred and have people put up your ISBN numbers and put it all up online cheap.

No, I write, yeah, I write my own books.

Yeah.

Um, it came out in 2013, April, 2013.

The next book was called the purpose principles.

And that was the one with penguin random house.

That one came out last year, January, 2015.

We got into Penguin because I met Jack Canfield.

He did the chicken soup with the soul books and he kind of, he kind of, him and his wife kind of took me in and, and, and then I, I was like, Hey, maybe it's time for the next book.

And, you know, went back to my agent.