James Oaten

There are still people linked with it and spread its ideology and stuff.

But they never went into any kind of detail about that.

And as we've established here, they didn't have to, to convince the chief magistrate.

But essentially the defence's argument was that, well, it's ridiculous.

Of course, she doesn't pose a threat.

But what they didn't bring forward was evidence

kind of any expert evidence yet to demonstrate those points.

Now, with the mother Corsa, Ahmad, we did hear from a forensic psychologist who talked about the rate of recidivism amongst those who have conducted terrorist activity being incredibly low.

So you can see that they're pushing that point, that the rate that someone would actually re-offend is very low, statistically speaking.

We know, for instance, we talked in the first episode, Peter Lowe,

an anti-violent extremism expert, she has been involved in the repatriation programs with Iraq to bring back some 10,000 people who were linked with Islamic State.

Not the actual fighters as much, but a lot of people who might have been involved or showed their support for them.

And she was involved with Iraq from 2023 until the end of last year with the UN and Iraq.

And what she said is most of those people come back, they do change their views.

They have changed their views.

You know, it can go both ways.

Sometimes people go into kind of Syrian refugee camps and become more radicalized.

But generally speaking, she told me that most do change their views.

They've gone there with one idea of what it is or what it should be and then leave that system with a very different mindset.

And when they do come back to home, they just want to live a peaceful life.