Jane Ward

Okay.

So, you know, the Italian philosopher Antonio Gramsci wrote about this very kind of cultural instability that when there's a long-standing norm, like patriarchal marriage, and it starts to crumble in some way, people catch on to the fact that it isn't really working, but...

We don't have a good alternative yet.

We haven't, as a society, invented the next new thing.

This produces kind of like a collective identity crisis.

You know, a lot of uncertainty.

And so a lot of people, where they go with that is they double down on tradition.

They're not really ready to make that next.

I think it's sort of an evolutionary step.

But for some people, they see it as, you know, everything's ruined.

And so they have a lot of anxiety about that.

So I do think it makes sense that we see all of these strategies right now.

Oh, absolutely.

I mean, there are straight people and they're not going away.

So that's not the answer.

And I think people sometimes want to make it more complicated than it is.

I mean, to my mind, the answer is feminism.

And specifically...

The answer is that we need men to embrace feminism as their own project.

And I don't think, you know, very few men have done that.