Jeff Hiller

And it's important to help other people.

And so for me, the church was the place that you went if you didn't have food, if you didn't have money to pay your rent, if you didn't have, you know, we had clothing drives and we always sort of had families through this organization that we would.

help provide with housing and with, you know, just whatever, toiletries, things like that.

A lot of people feel the church is a place that is oppressive and othering people.

And there are a lot of churches like that, and they've sort of co-opted the narrative.

But for me, the church was a place where you could be accepted and where you could be loved.

And it wasn't until I came out that I kind of realized that

They weren't really into gay people yet.

Yeah, no one was ever surprised when I came out.

But I didn't realize you couldn't be a pastor and be gay.

And that has since changed.

The church now does allow openly queer pastors.

But at the time, you had to be celibate, whereas straight pastors could marry and have kids and things like that.

And so for me, it was like a surprise that the church was oppressive.

Yeah.

And it was also, I mean, I say confusing.

It's not like I was completely unaware that gayness wasn't considered bad in the world, but it was more insulting than confusing.

It was more like, but I've played all the, I've done it.

I've been here and you've been here with me and we've been together.

And how could you now say I'm not welcome?