Jefferson Fisher

And both of the houses had burnt down.

I sent him something specific I could help him with.

I can't remember the details of what I said, but he came up and said, thank you for sending me something.

Lots of people sent me messages, but I remember you sent me something specific.

And make a genuine offer to support.

A real... Yes.

And also, as you said at the start, not an offer that they have to accept.

Yeah.

Because no one accepts them.

Amen.

I've heard that so many times from my guests on this podcast where they talk about their hardest moment, and it's always who showed up in that moment.

I was thinking about the neuroscience of what's going on there.

When you get someone to admit that they're hurtful.

I remember interviewing some neuroscientists who talked about this idea of cognitive dissonance, which is where we all have a perception of who we are.

And I guess by what you're doing there, you're...

creating the cognitive dissonance which is the cognitive mental discomfort by making me kind of look in the mirror at who i who i just acted like if i i don't think i'm a hurtful person if i say something super hurtful and then you ask me if i meant to be hurtful you're immediately like speaking to my identity yes and i don't want i'm not a hurtful person

Right.

And that's causing the dissonance, which is sort of the disparity between who I think I am and how I just behaved.

Yes.

And so I have to alleviate one of them.