Jordan Schneider

economy stops working like GDP just goes away.

Yeah.

I mean, look, she has this great line.

I think he said it in a 2020 speech where he's like,

we want to not be dependent on other countries and we want other countries to be dependent on us.

I think, you know, when you see Lutnick talking about how he wants to get China addicted to H20s, like it's the same dynamic playing out on both sides.

And yeah, that is super messy.

And that means that sort of there are two systems which are really wrestling with each other.

Like, I think that

Look, I honestly don't feel like the Trump administration deserves to earn as much sort of like cognitive coherence as you may have put it so eloquently, Azeem.

But there is, I think, a new instinct to the melange of like things you care about.

of not wanting to be reliant on China because you can't trust them because they're scary.

And oh, by the way, they can shut down Ford plants in a week if they feel like it.

And vice versa, right?

Sure.

That understanding, I think, has been in the Chinese system for much longer.

And there was an understanding in the 70s, 80s, 90s, 2000s, even early 2010s, that it just like we're just going to have to live with it because we're too poor to kind of break out of the interdependence.

But now that China is richer and

So now, now we get to talk about chips and AI.

You saw the EU this week talking about semiconductor sovereignty.