Katty Kay

That's the bad one.

He got the state visit plus and the Chinese rolled out every piece of red carpet they could find in the country and showered him with love and praise.

And I'm just, is this going to be the same?

Is this going to be the same sort of, maybe it has to be a gold carpet now anyway, or a gold statue, a gold statue of Trump.

Maybe that would help if he turned up at Beijing airport.

Yeah, I think Trump, I mean, to that point of it's kind of with Trump often it's all personal and foreign leaders kind of now get Trump after however long he's been on our national stage, 430 years.

I mean, it feels like that.

I wonder sometimes if he mistakes these relationships because he is proud of saying that he has good personal relationships with Kim Jong-un, with Vladimir Putin, with the King of...

the United Kingdom with Xi Jinping.

And I don't know that he really understands that he may be misjudging the power of the relationship and the nature of the relationship himself.

And in a way that could weaken his position.

So I think he thinks I can go in there, be leader to leader, work my famous art of the deal charm on him with a bit of leverage thrown in.

And because we understand each other man to man, we're going to get something done, which is some kind of

grand bargain.

I don't know that he realizes that's not actually the way.

They have processes, and they actually do have institutions, and they do have a national security council or whatever the national security council equivalent is, and this goes through formal steps.

It's not actually all just done leader to leader.

Anyway, he may not have that great relationship that he thinks he does.

All of the documents or any of the documents?

We're actually going to be speaking a lot more about Susie Wells in the bonus episode for founding members, if you'd like to listen to that.