Lee Strobel

Which was a great church.

I have friends who went to that church.

They loved it.

They grew spiritually.

It's a great church.

And then to have that happen, it's like you have to tell people –

How do you wrestle those two ideas?

Well, I think first of all, for those who are quote-unquote victims in the sense that they're part of a church that pastor falls and so forth, how do they not lose their faith?

I think number one is our faith is not in the pastor.

Our faith is in Jesus.

Our faith is in God.

And I mentioned to you earlier the reasons why I became convinced that Jesus is who he claimed to be through his resurrection from the dead.

Historical data.

i go back to that i go back to that yes there are men of god who fall and who sin and who forfeit their pulpit because of immorality but i go back to the evidence i go back to the how do i know how do i know christianity is true i look at the four e's and say yeah jesus did return from the dead he did prove he's the son of god that has nothing to do with bill hybels you know so

I want to set that boundary and say I want to rely on, you know, it's called in the Christian world apologetics, defense of the faith, reasons to believe.

In terms of the pastors, there's got to be accountability.

There's got to be, you know, I see a lot of churches where the elders of the church are employees of the church.

Well, you can't hold the senior pastor accountable if he's your boss, right?

So your incentive is to protect them.

Exactly.