Lulu Garcia Navarro

Can I ask you what exactly –

You mean when you say happy, though?

Because I was thinking about the nature of moments when I felt happy.

I lived for two years in Rio de Janeiro and I would wake up every morning and I would look out the window and you couldn't be unhappy there because it was just so beautiful.

And I had my young daughter and she would go to the beach every day and I had good friends.

And...

It's not even like looking back I was happy.

I knew at the time that I was experiencing sort of happiness.

Is that different than just general well-being?

You used the word toxic positivity.

I mean, I think you're referring to this idea that we always need to be feeling great and exuding optimism.

Is that what you're pushing back against?

Yeah, that's it.

Do you worry if this idea of pursuing happiness, always striving for more, actually creates unhappiness?

You know, when I was thinking about this, initially I was like, oh, this is such a modern idea, this idea of happiness.

You know, this pursuit of happiness is something that I'm sure they didn't care about in the Middle Ages when they were struggling to eat.

They weren't worried about, you know, maximizing their sense of joy and aspiration to live the good life.

And then I was sort of struck by the fact that this has been something very human for a very long time.

All right.

So that brings us to what we deal with today.