Marie

Don't come and sing that song to me, boys will be boys. I lost my child. Those kids, they get to go home. They get to be whoever they want to be. Well, my son wanted to be a doctor. He wanted to be a neurosurgeon. You just cut it up like that. And then what happened? Nothing. Nothing. And I have to take it like that? No. I lost my child. My one and only child. My good son. My beautiful son.

And I remember he was five years old. One day he says to me, Mommy, will I ever have a father? I said, you had a father. Your father was big. Your father loved you very, very much.

I have a big plaque for George. He did say hazing is the cause of death. And Cornell put it in the wall where all the students have to pass that wall to go sign up to become a brother or a sister to be part of the sorority. And they can read it. I want them to think because it's a crime. No parent should bury their children. Not when they are healthy.

No parent should send their kids to college and not to have the police come and tell them something like that. Sometimes I walk on the street and I still hear the police voice in my head.

He was the captain of the soccer team. Once George set his sights on a career, his dream school quickly became clear. Cornell was his choice from the beginning. When he got the letter from Cornell and he took it, went to his room, closed the door, and when he opened it, I just heard a scream. And I went and I said, what's going on? He said, I got accepted.

What do brothers do for brothers? What do sisters do for sisters? We help each other. We talk.

When it first happened, the humiliation that I went through, because everybody looking at me like, you know, oh, he was drinking, he was drinking. As a mom, I felt like I failed him. Maybe there is something I didn't tell him. Maybe there is something I forgot to say for him. But George did exactly everything he was supposed to do. He called the chaperone car to pick him up.

And they decided that because they were planning a kidnapping to make their big brother happy. and my poor child become dead.

The first person who called me, she called me from California. She said, Marie, I'm sorry for what you went through. If you want to talk, I'm here for you. I'm sorry you joined our club.

And I still can hear his screams still today. He was so happy because that was the school he wanted to go to. And then when he find out they were going to give him all those scholarships, it was, to me, I was so happy.

We spoke about drugs, we spoke about alcohol, we spoke about sex. I said to him, I know I'm not there, but please do not drink. Because when you drink, you drink to get drunk. I said, just be careful. And remember, because you have a goal, you cannot play with your life doing all those things.

As for the fraternity, I didn't know anything about the fraternity. This is not something that came in my mind at all. This is that one conversation that I didn't have with him. And then I said, that's the only thing I didn't know anything. Because if I knew, I would ask questions. I would talk to him about it.

He only told me about it after he did it, when he came home in December. And he says to me, I'm one of the brother now. And he explained to me, this is why he said, you see, I'm okay.

We always talk every week. This is what was important. So he can call me anytime. I said, call me as you're going to your dorm or as you're going to school, to a class. This is the way he was. He never missed one Friday, except for that dreadful Friday.

He was getting ready. He had two interviews because he had two internships coming. So he needed to prepare himself for the interview. He went to his girlfriend because she knows how to do interviews and he was practicing with her.

I saw two police officers. I got a call from the police at Cornell to say that my son died in his sleep. And I said, no, that's not true. I spoke to him yesterday. He's fine. And they just said they couldn't look at me. And I think I fell on the floor and I was screaming. And then the next thing I know, they took me to the ER. And I still didn't know what happened.

George, he was a child who wanted to learn everything. As a young age, he loves to read, love math and science.

Hi, Dr. John. Thank you so much for taking my call.

Um, I am a 60 plus year old woman who I obtained custody of my grandson back in 2014. Um, Both his parents are addicts. His father, he's 18 right now. He is away at college. His father is still actively using. His mother, my daughter, has had a couple relapses, and I believe right at this moment she is sober. My question, though, is having to raise my grandson and...

just trying to find that balance on trying to live my life, you know, raising my children. And then usually that's the time where after your children are, you know, in their own lives, that's the time that you become, you can worry about yourself and start, you know, living your life. And I'm just having that hard time because now I have, I'm actively raising my grandson.

His parents really are not, a major part of his life. He can't count on them at all. Like I'm still the one who has to go to parent functions because like they'll say they'll be there for him, but they, they know just never show up. So I'm, I'm just trying to find that balance for me as well as be there for him because he still really needs me.

Oh, you know what? I feel bad for me, but I feel so bad for him.

Oh, yes.

Oh, thank you.

Yes.

A few.

Um... You know what? I don't even know. I don't even know. I just never think about what I want or what I need. I'm still working full time, so I get up, I go to work. I just do.

Okay. What do you want? What do I want? I want to I want to be able to travel. I want to be able to just not think of any responsibilities I have.

Um, you know, I just, I want to not have to worry about everybody else and just worry about me.

Yes.

Yeah.

Yes. And we both missed out on that.

No, no. You're right. I need to just forget about that. No, don't forget about it.

Yes.

Oh, absolutely. We have an amazing relationship and we talk a lot. And as a matter of fact, he was just home recently. He came home for the weekend and he did. He told me that He knows I'm always there for him, and he thanks me. You know, give me a big hug, kiss, tell me you love me, and he said thank you. So, yes, he does know.

Nothing at all. There you go. Nothing at all. That's like the greatest moment. That's right. It solidifies that I did everything right.

Absolutely. Absolutely.

No, no, no.

I would go out to dinner with a few friends.

Something ridiculous, something I would never think to do?

Okay.

I will. I will definitely try.

Let me see. Definitely want to start either going back to the gym or setting aside half hour, an hour a day just to take a walk or read a book or something like that. Something to just disconnect and just be.

Okay.

A hundred times, right. That's right. Yes, absolutely.

I hope so.

She does know I love her. Yes, she does. Deep down, she does.

Okay.

Right, just right.

I am with somebody now. Yes.

Or both? Very good. A little bit of both, and that's good.

And you know what? He really has, he really tries. And I'm always, and I'm always like so centered on, uh, my, my grandson or, you know, what's going on with him. And, So we've had those talks. So I need to just let him do these things for me and not worry so much about my grandson.

Okay. You know, that's a good idea to do. That way I don't have to worry about, you know, is my phone near me? Is he going to need me? You know, and just...

Like, I am mom. I am dad.

Right. Right. I can't be everything to him.

Thank you so much.

We're just glad you're feeling better. Yesterday wasn't great when you came in.

Hi, Dr. John. My question for you today is, gosh, just dealing with the I guess memories and like consequences and just struggles of my past and coming into a new marriage with a wonderful man. Um, yeah, it's just been, it's been hard and I'm just wanting to fully enjoy him.

Mm-hmm.

Um, but having that past and kind of thinking I had, you know, gotten through it and left it and was, um, yeah, moved, moved through it. But then you like bring a new person into your life and, um, Yeah, it's been hard.

Yes.

Yeah. I'm 28, and my husband and I met only a year ago. But we are both believers, and so just right away we knew that, like, this was the person God had been preparing us for.

Yeah.

Okay.

Yeah. I guess just, yeah, I mean, my past is a lot more like checkered with just a lot of different like strings of relationships and, um, kind of like finding my home and whoever I would be dating. Um, and my husband's wonderful. He waited for, you know, his wife. And so that's been such a blessing, but also just wishing I had had that to offer to him too.

Mm-hmm.

I don't know.

Um, and I did share like upfront, like I was like, this is everything. And I wanted to be like fully known by him. And, um, I guess also like, there's an element that I feel like I, I wish I didn't like take him from someone better, you know? And I, I don't know why that's, that's a thing because we're so happy together. Truly. Like he's wonderful.

Okay.

That's what I'm afraid of.

Yeah.

Right.

Okay. I can do that.

Right.

No.

Right.

Yes.

I don't know. Okay, I'm worried. Okay.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I can do that.

I can do that.

I guess, I mean, I guess I, I guess I think I am, you know, I have like, gosh, you just, I just go back and forth. I'm like, I wish I knew better. Like, I don't know. I just feel like I was, like, my brain wasn't even there until I was 25, you know?

Yeah. Yeah, exactly. I know I have a lot to offer him, and I just, like, I kind of, it's just more, I think it's just, like, the memories, you know? Like, those are going to be there no matter what.

Yeah. I have wonderful parents, but it was just a really like stressful home. And I, They were trying to do what's best for me, and they kicked me out of the house at 18. I mean, they still supported me in other ways, but I just kind of felt like I had to find somewhere.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Just a really stressed out family. Okay. I don't have like a ton of memories of it, but my sister is older than me and she, you know, She held a lot of anger and then of what she went through. And I think I just blocked it out mostly. So what I remember of the stress is from like secondhand from her telling me.

My past is a lot more, like, checkered with strings of relationships. And my husband's wonderful. He waited for, you know, his life. And so that's been such a blessing. But also just wishing I had had that to offer to him, too. Why don't you think you're wonderful, Marie?

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yes.

He's awesome. He's kind of a redneck. He works on cars and he's... comes from a really good family. He's got a twin sister who loves him and his whole family is just wonderful. And I mean, he's in the military and he works on airplanes and he loves me. And I do think it's the first time I've actually felt safe. I know you use that word for the other relationships.

Yeah. But just meeting him, I knew that he really sounds cheesy, but really saw me.

No.

Yeah.

No, I don't think so. I don't think I miss it. I want it to stop coming through my head.

Yeah, that's it.

50%.

50% gangster.

I'm 28.

I don't know. Probably like a swim cover-up going to the beach. Okay.

Blonder than now.

Long.

Yeah, I had it two weeks ago, and it was rough.

Yeah. Tell her to wait for it. To try to be patient.

Okay.

I did not give you the flu.

Okay.

I mean, like half our sales team is down with it. There are so many people down with it.

Hey, you.

Pretty good. Excited. A little nervous.

Yeah, so I'll just start with my question that I submitted. My question is, when is the best time to disclose my divorce to people I date? I'm 24 and have just started dating again after getting divorced from my ex-husband who I was with for five years. I feel like being this young in divorce carries a lot of stigma and I'm afraid of scaring people away with my past. Yeah, what happened?

Yeah, what happened? We met shortly before I turned 19. He had just got back from a deployment. We dated for about a year, and then we got married right after I turned 20.

During that year of dating and that first year of marriage, he struggled significantly with alcohol and mental health to the point where there were many nights where he was going to tell me he was going to end his life and then just wouldn't answer my calls or my texts. So I wouldn't know if he did it until the next morning when he would text me and told me he was just drunk.

So about a year into the marriage, I considered getting a divorce, mainly due to the alcoholism and his refusal to get help. But there were tons of other reasons as well. However, he committed to stop drinking. So I was willing to rebuild with the very clear boundary that if he ever drank again, I would be done. He was sober for two and a half years, but we were having significant marital issues

We couldn't communicate without arguing. I felt like a maid and a mother. He would get very angry sometimes and break things in our house and yell, but it was never directed at me. And in response to me telling him I was unhappy and I didn't know if I wanted to stay married, he went out that night to a bar and broke his sobriety and called me the next morning and let me know.

And I just knew I couldn't live through that again. So that's when I initiated the separation and the divorce.

Since December, but we've been separated since last May, so it's coming up on a year.

Yeah.

A little bit.

Yeah, I think there's days where, especially I've listened to your show a lot since all that happened and talking about rebuilding and things. And it just makes me think like, what if I had given a chance of saying like, okay, but this is very clear what I want. And if you like giving him the option to opt in or out, I didn't do that. I just, he did.

Yeah.

Yeah, you're right about that. And to be fair, the people I have gone on dates with and told, I mean, their reaction is obviously a little shocked, but there's not really any judgment. If anything, they're like, okay, that's cool. I mean, when I tell them, like, you know, it's giving me a different perspective on things I want and, you know, they, they're accepting of it.

I think it really is a, an inside battle.

Yes, it does. And I mean, we were officially divorced in December, but like things kept being drug out because he wouldn't stick to the agreement. So he wouldn't sign paperwork he needed to sign. So it felt like even though it's been finalized, like it's still not like done, done. And so that was maybe like two weeks ago that it finally got done. There you go.

And so now it feels like I can finally like, okay.

Yeah. I mean, I still... Still that way, I think a lot of what I'm worried about is the reason I'm telling people that. Like, oh, I left because he broke his sobriety. That to me just sounds so cold. Like you couldn't stick with the person you love.

Yeah.

Right, yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Hi, how's it going?

Uh, not sitting in my car. I can't believe I'm doing this.

Okay. So it's kind of changed since I originally wrote my question.

Excellent. All right. Okay. So starting in like mid December, it was like a week and a half before Christmas. I suddenly just stopped sleeping, basically. I would go to bed, fall asleep totally normally, and then pop up like three hours later and just not be able to go back to sleep.

At all.

I did not. It felt like it was so out of nowhere. Okay. And I have a one, a three, and a four-year-old.

Yeah, well, I mean, I've been around for a year, a little more.

Yeah, you know, pretty quickly. And, yeah, it felt like it was pretty out of nowhere.

No, totally.

Okay.

Well, the thought spiral that would happen is, was usually like first I would start to panic knowing that I was probably not going to fall back asleep.

And then I would immediately start thinking about everything that I had to get done the next day that was about to be ruined. Right. And everything because it's the holidays that is about to get ruined and I'm going to make myself sound like a crazy person but then the thought spiral continues.

And then it goes into, oh my gosh, if I am this level of sleep deprived, then I have a hard time not being impatient with my three very small children. And then I'm going to be a terrible mom that day. And my kids are getting a subpar childhood. And it just goes and goes and goes. And I just find myself spending so much energy trying to actively stop my thoughts snowball. There you go.

Yeah. That's it.

I am. Yes.

Actually, yes. Yes and no.

Yes, because I wish I was sleeping. No, because he's been like a rock star through all of it.

Okay.

I failed, but yes, I tried.

Yes, that's accurate.

Yes. Definitely the not having it in my head that there's zero time to sit down and that if one thing goes off the rails, then everything is toast. I just don't know how to get out of that thought pattern. It's so hard. I don't know how to make my brain stop doing that.

Yeah. Yeah.

I'm staying at home right now.

I actually am not. I have like the best friends ever. I'm so blessed. I feel like I have an army of people.

Yes.

Do y'all talk about- Not as much as I'd like, but yeah.

Yeah, we do.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Great. My, my husband's wonderful.

Oh no, he's, we, we honestly, we've, uh, we actually, we've been both been listening to your show for like a year now. And we've put into practice a lot of things that we've heard you talk about. And we did a little year-end meeting.

We were like, this is, I just feel like we've been married 11 years. And I was like, year 11 was just the best year for us, even though I stopped sleeping.

Okay.

Yes.

Okay.

Yeah.

Yeah, I do. I hear you.

Right. Yeah, I can definitely relate to that.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Okay.

Hey. What up? Dr. John. Sitting here in the rainy western Pennsylvania. Kind of nervous today.

Talking to you. Oh, okay.

I'm glad you called. What's up? Okay, so... This is my initial question. So how can I have a conversation with my husband about the nature of our relationship without it turning into an argument every single time?

Well, he does... Honestly, we argue about everything. We don't really communicate that well. Try going to therapy. Like, I was... I'm in therapy. I've been in for about three years. I try to get him to go and he doesn't like say anything. And I don't know how to get him to open up and communicate with me. And I'm like, I'm at a point where I'm one foot in and one foot out the door.

I don't know. I mean, it's like, so.

Like, I don't know. Yeah.

I don't, yeah. I mean, I get it.

Nowhere.

I don't know. I mean, feeling of like, I just wish you would I don't know. I just wish he would listen.

Well, and I think that's where I'm realizing it's not bringing me anything. So I'm shutting down from it. And I'm just not talking to him like at all. And then he takes that as everything's hunky-dory fine.

Yeah.

Yeah, I think we both have quit at this point.

No.

Yeah. He just changes the topic, though. Every time we're arguing about something, I'll try to tell him, I've got one foot out the door. I'm like, I can't keep going around in these circles. And then he'll bring up an argument we had about something stupid. I don't even know. Just like random stuff, like stupid things. Like, why didn't I wash his laundry?

Sometimes I think I am.

I don't know.

I think that's what I'm afraid of doing. Okay. Is opening up to him. Cause I don't know how he's going to receive that.

No.

Not at all.

I don't even know if that's it because in his and I's relationship, I've spent all of our almost 20 years together basically taking care of him and I've gotten pushed to the wayside and now I don't know how to say what I need and hope that he will come back at me with, okay, I'm here for you because that's what I'm afraid he's not, he's not going to.

No, no, not, not really. No, he's, he, he's, have you been his mother for the last 20 years? Pretty much.

Yeah, I felt like his mom.

Yeah, I've kind of felt like his mom that he lost years ago, and I have a fourth child in my house in a way.

Yeah.

Yep.

And I think that's where I'm at. I do want to try to figure out, hey, is this worth rebuilding or are we just giving up? I don't want to completely give up on it yet.

It does.

Yeah. I want, I feel like I want someone to take care of me instead of me taking care of someone.

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah. I don't know that he'll be out. I have a hard time telling him what's on my mind and what I'm thinking.

even though he was primary caregiver of the children when I'm not there and handled so much.

Yeah.

I'm 25.

Yeah, it's tricky to navigate sometimes.

I probably wouldn't.

Yes. Yes. I actually just got married in December.

It's been great. I have a lovely husband. I can't say anything negative about him.

Very challenging, yeah. I definitely felt burnt out these past few weeks taking on the extra responsibilities, and it's just left me with nothing to come home with. My husband has been you know, taking on a lot of those responsibilities that were mine at home as a result.

Oh, yikes. I don't want to be. I definitely don't.

Right, right.

Mm-hmm. Yeah. So I did try to bring this up to her recently, this past Friday. And a lot of emotions came up on her end. Initially, she said, well, you know, I just need someone here that can handle it, that can help me out. I need help more than ever. And just really...

putting that pressure on me, um, making me feel like if I, you know, speak up on, on what's troubling me, feeling burnt out, um, too much, then I could lose my position. She'll just replace me with someone who's willing to just do it, you know, work full time, overtime, no break. Like, like I have been for the past few weeks.

Yeah. No, I know it's not her intention, but I feel like she's been put in a tough spot.

They are, yes. I haven't had much of a break these past few weeks. I'm sorry.

Yeah. I know there's that people pleaser tendency in me to just, you know, grit and bear it. And, you know, I have my faith to fall back on. I don't feel like I'm going to break, but it is difficult. really need to be in this situation.

I had feelings even before this happened, even before he left that, um, it was starting to become an unhealthy work environment, not really being appreciated, um, the way I feel like I should, but, um, And your answer has been confirmed. Yeah, I guess so. I guess so.

Yeah. Yeah. I feel like I've She's had to lean on me for emotional support a bit in this situation.

Hello.

I'm good. How are you?

I wanted to ask your advice on something. My question is, how can I support a family in crisis while balancing my own priorities?

So I am a nanny. I take care of two children. I've been with this current family for a little over two and a half years. And they... The parents are going through some marital issues. The dad has been inconsistent with his presence. He kind of left abruptly a few weeks ago, and the mom and I are just kind of picking up the pieces and trying to manage the household without him. Oh.

About $150,000.

Fridge and the washer and dryer.

Yes, we are.

No, we do not.

it's still in a negotiation we offered like 3 000 less than we had originally offered if they're not going to include the appliances but we're still waiting to hear back i think that since we're just at that five percent i think i'm just like nervous that your border your borderline i mean you're not you're not stroking a big check here you know i the other thing you could do is say uh i don't have to buy this house

Yeah.

It's $320,000.

Hi, I'm doing good. Thank you guys for taking my call.

So me and my husband just finished up Baby Step 3D, and we are buying our first home. So we just put in an offer for a house that we really like. It was very reasonably priced. We have about 5% down that you guys recommend for the first home. And in negotiations, the sellers weren't willing to give up their appliances because And so that was going to be an extra $3,000 cost.

We have like the 5% down, a little bit extra for closing costs, and our emergency fund. And I'm not sure if that $3,000 should come from taking a little bit less down, our emergency fund, or if it's a sign that we're just not ready to buy a house yet.

Well, I guess what we've seen is from the beginning, we've always said we want you saving. 75% has always been our rule. Wow. But just because that we just set up to be able to pay for cars and things like that. So he did real good. He bought his old truck. We met him halfway there. But really, since then, it's been hard for him to meet that.

Something comes up, things like that, which is understandable. I know he's a teenager.

I'm just letting you know. I know, but they're full. When they have to pay for everything... I just, I want them to get there and, you know, have some spending money and maybe not have to work when they're in college. But right now he doesn't have anything really. And so we've recently even said, if you can't figure it out with paying for gas,

and saving 75% and giving that we might even pull paying for insurance and let him take a year off of having a car.

I think you are.

But you wouldn't. You wouldn't threaten to take their car insurance if they don't aren't wise with their money this summer.

I would say let him budget it. He doesn't have it.

I think he definitely can. But, I mean, we're still an 18-year-old at times. Sure. I mean, he's 18. There's definitely light. There's ability there for sure. Yeah.

Well, I have four kids. My oldest is 18. And looking at college this fall, I am trying to, I'm wrestling, me and my husband are wrestling with how to instill the wisdom that we want him to have. He's had a job since he was 16, on and off.

around school and things like that but we've recently told him he's got to start paying for his own gas in his old truck that we we helped him pay for halfway like dave teaches and it just feels like it's a big burden on him um we're going to pay for his schooling but he's got to pay for all extras and after two years he has to pay for even his schooling so we're really trying to teach him we want you to start learning really how to save and manage your money

And I just, I don't know. Am I being too harsh? Is it too much? He's just got a door knocking job right now. He has a full time job lined up, but it's not started yet for this summer. I just, I'm trying to strike that balance between being too harsh and helping him. I just don't know. So I wanted your advice.

Hi, it's going good. My name is Marie and I'm 33 years old and I'm wondering how I get unstuck from a relationship.

Okay, sorry, I'm a little nervous. It's okay, take a breath. Okay, so about a year ago, I met a guy on a dating app. It went really well. I felt like I had worked on myself a lot for about six months, was ready to finally fall in love and meet the right person. First date went great. We even talked about possible couples therapy on the first date.

because so I brought up I'm very like trying to bring up deal breakers early but it felt very natural when I first saw him and then I brought up how I plan on going to school and if that's a problem for him he brought up how he got divorced so I was asking how long ago and then like later on I asked him more about his divorce and he said something about oh it just didn't work out because we

like got married too young. And I said, well, did you ever try couples therapy? And he said, yes. And he's like, I love that you asked that question. Like I would want that in a future partner and stuff like that. So I was like, Oh, okay. Green flags. Cool. So fast forward, we dated for 11 months, met his family. He is from England. So I flew to England and met his family.

We even went to Paris for a weekend. He met my family, came to my brother's wedding, very like asking like, where are you at? Where are your feelings at? Et cetera. He was always very reassuring. I felt very respected, considered, loved in the relationship. But about five months in, I brought up like my feelings because he hadn't said I love you yet.

And I hadn't said it either, but I was feeling those feelings. So I brought that up because we were just about to go to England to meet his family. And I just wanted to know where he was at. And he said that he just wants to be really sure when he says that. And I found out more about his divorce. He got kind of screwed over financially. She didn't want to go to therapy, stuff like that.

So I was like, okay, that makes sense. And he's like, I said, so you just want me to be patient? He said, yes, just, you know, be patient. So when we go to England, he says, I feel closer to you. Like everything is just going great. So much so that I was moving cities and he was actually planning on moving to the same city. We started dating about an hour, like we were living about an hour apart.

And then I moved about two hours away from him. And then he followed eventually because he was waiting on his house to sell. When he sold his house, I said, you know, why don't you just stay with me for a little bit? Because he was trying to buy another house. And so he said, oh yeah, that's a great idea. We can like see how that goes. Looking back, it was not a great idea, but why not?

Just because he hadn't said I love you yet. And I was just like, I don't it was supposed to be temporary. And then when he did move in, everything went great to where when he was looking at houses, he was considering me moving with him into his new house. And I don't know. So fast forward, we get he goes to Thanksgiving with me with my family goes to Christmas with me with my family.

And then after the new year, he got distant and I brought up, hey, I feel a little disconnected from you right now. Something I'd like learn from your show to ask. And he was like, yeah, I actually think we're a little too comfortable and like too complacent. And I'm like, OK, what does that mean? Exactly. I was just like, what do you mean?

And he was like, I think like, because at that point, he was like, well, this was supposed to be temporary. And now we're talking about me staying here because he had put in an offer on a house and it didn't work out. So then he was going to stay with me till my lease was up. And then we were going to move together. Okay. And I said, basically, like, okay.

And he's like, well, this was supposed to be temporary. And you kind of pressured me into moving or like staying here. And I said, no, I just expressed how I felt. And I was excited. And I thought things were going well. And you expressed the same thing back is how I took that. He's like, oh yeah, you're right. And I was like, okay. And so he was just getting like a little distant.

And then I said, well, do you think you can get there? Like saying like, I love you. Cause this had become like a little bit of a topic. And then he had always said like, absolutely. Yes. Even before he put an offer on a house after that, he said, absolutely. And now he said, I don't know. So then I was just like, okay, and start freaking out. And I don't know.

So then we talked over the next like few weeks and it led to us breaking up. And I told him like, okay, well, what do you think love is like the next day? And then he couldn't really tell me. So I said, well, maybe I said, are you still going to therapy? And he said, no. And I said, well, why did you stop? You know, you got divorced.

And I found out a lot more about his divorce in this conversation and like things that he wasn't necessarily like upfront with me about. And he was like omitting.

So, originally, when I asked him on the first date, how long ago did he get divorced, he told me six months, which was not true. And then he did, like, backtrack on that date and said, like, oh, well, the paperwork was filed later. But it turned out it was about three months from her moving out of the house and then us going on our first date.

And the paperwork was filed, like, a few weeks before we went on our first date. So... That's a big difference than being like six months. And he said they had problems for years. But then I also found out that they were trying for a baby right before they got divorced, like months before. And like she had a miscarriage and all of this.

So I was just like, and I asked him on our first date, are you healed from all of that? And he said, yes. And I was like, well, obviously you were like I said that I feel like you have a mental block from saying I love you. Like, I don't know. So he said he was going to go back to therapy. And I went to my therapist and she recommended couples therapy.

I brought that up to him and he said, well, let me go to my therapist for a couple of weeks. And I'm not saying no, but I just want to like.

No, not yet. He was just saying like we talked about it and he said I did a couple of things that reminded him of his ex. So he just kind of like shut down.

Yeah, it was me asking him about he wanted to go to this festival and I had to work that day and he was going with some friends. And I said, well, who are the who are the friends you're going with? Are there guys or girls? Because I was trying to get that day off. So I was just trying to like see if I could go.

well he got really weird and then he said well it's just the guys from the gym and I was like okay and I was like so no girls are going like you don't want me to go and he said well yeah I just kind of want to go with the guys from the gym and I said oh okay no problem like I was trying to get the day off because I wanted to go but so like things like that I guess his ex was like an anxious avoidant where she would make him feel bad for like going out but wouldn't want to spend time with him when he was home

I think he was projecting what was being triggered from his past.

Because I was like, I agree. That's a fair question. And we talked about that. And he said, oh, I feel better. So then we tried to work on it. But he was still living with me while he was trying to move out. So the problem was, like, I was asking, like, hey, like, I just need a little reassurance. Like, you can't say you love me. I just need to know you still want to be with me and work on this.

And he just was getting more distant and weird. And then... We had a date night and at the end of the date night, I don't know, I just felt like things were off. So I was like, he's not a words of affirmation guy. And I'm very much like, I need to hear it, especially like when you show it in all the other ways, but I need to know what you're thinking. Right.

So I brought up, I was like, well, can you tell me something to love about me? Like in a joking, funny way, like we're watching TV. And then he just like kind of got weird and was like, don't you're being ridiculous. And I was like, why is that ridiculous? And he just like kind of laughed and was being silly, but saying like, that's ridiculous. And I said, no, it's not.

And I said, I'm really struggling. Like, I just want to know, like, you care. And then he instead of talking to me, he got up to the other side of the room and was like extremely distant. And then that was the night where I was like, OK, like we're we're having a real fight. issue. And so then I said, I need space, like clearly you need space.

And then the week after he went out of town for work for a week. So it gave us that space. And it just like felt like very matter of fact and weird. And so when he came back, I basically told him like, hey, like either we go to couples therapy and like figure this out and like have a guideline on how to like take this slow or we break up because I'm not gonna sit here and wait around for you to

figure out what's going on in your head like if you're not keeping me in the loop because he was basically asking for distance but it was like indefinite distance where I was like I can't do that so technically you kind of ended the relationship yeah technically I ended it but he he showed he said he doesn't have the capacity like he said I can't do it and didn't want to go to couples therapy said it was too early for couples therapy which makes no sense he said he wanted to do preventative couples therapy on our first date I was like

Yeah.

So he moved out January 25th. So it was about two months ago, a little over two months ago.

Well, so when we broke up, when he moved out two days later after we decided to break up and at the end of it, I said, okay, from my understanding, I have offered to take things slow with you. I've been okay with you moving out. I've been okay. You know, like I just wanted to go to couples therapy and see if we can like work on this. But you don't have the capacity for that.

And I'm not going to wait around. So we're broken up. And I said it like that, like very matter of fact. And I was trying to be very matter of fact that day. I hadn't cried like I was just like helping him get his stuff out. And he just started bawling, crying and then said that he hopes this will work out for us later and that we're too compatible for this to not work out.

Because we were both very happy in the relationship. This came out of nowhere. It's just, he felt pressure or whatever. I don't know. Like he doesn't even know. And so that's kind of how he left it was just basically like, you know, I hope we can be together later. And I said like, well, I have to respect myself and I'm not going to wait around for you.

And then obviously that messes with your head.

Yeah. So about a week after he took all our pictures down from Instagram. So then I was like, okay, that's a very different signal than what you're telling me on.

Yeah. So then, but I called him over it because I was just, and then, so then I just said, okay, I'm moving on. Cause I was just like, what's the purpose of this? So I didn't like go crazy thinking about it. And then about a month later, I had a package sent to, I hadn't gotten in his mail for weeks. And then all of a sudden I have a package for him that he sent to me on accident.

Like not sure if it was on accident or not. So then I was trying to do 30 days, no contact. So I didn't even tell him about the package. And I was like, maybe I'll just keep it to pickleball paddle.

No, it was addressed to him. So I was just like, I'm going to wait till 30 days and I'll probably reach out and tell him I have a paddle. So then he reached out to me a few days later and was like, hey, I think I accidentally sent you my paddle. So then I said, okay, yeah, I have it. Like I was going to forward it to you, but I wasn't sure if it would go to your new apartment or what.

He said, well, can I actually come pick it up? And I said, sure. So he came over to pick it up and I was going to leave it outside, but I was like, I just kind of want to see where his head's at. It's been a month. So when I opened the door, I was very standoffish, but he was like very happy to see my dog, very happy to see me, asked me how I was. And I just was like, good.

And like very standoffish. And then after that, he texted me and was like, that was really weird. I just want to let you know that I'm really working on myself and going to therapy and this time is healing. And you mean a lot to me. So that didn't make me feel good. You don't need to respond to this. And then that was like a month ago. So I haven't heard from him since.

No, I didn't respond. I'm trying to be strong. I don't know. It's just hard because it's like it'd be different if it's like he's not going to therapy and he's not working on himself. And I don't honestly like think about it. I'm like, OK, but I don't know if he has a good therapist. I don't know if he's actually going anymore.

But it'd be easier if I just know like he is who he is and I can like move on. But it's just. I just feel like I'm going to start dating somebody else and he's going to pop back up. And I don't know, we just had such a great relationship. And I just felt so loved and considered in that relationship, even though he wouldn't say I love you.

I don't want to say it's a regret because if I... For next time, I obviously won't let somebody move in with me if they can't say I love you. But... I'm glad I let him because this brought all of this out. You know what I mean? So if he didn't move in with me early on, I think this would have just been more prolonged.

So the last few men I've dated, I feel like I keep attracting are like people that tell me they're they're ready for something. And then when we get into it, then they turn out to not be ready. OK. The last one was only like about a month. So it's like easier when it like happens in the first few months. But I just got really got way too excited about him too early.

And so I went to therapy over it because I was like, what am I missing? I was just being like really hard on myself.

That I need to give myself grace and that I can't know everything in the beginning.

So like in general, like to attract.

I don't think I got super excited about this one until like five months. Okay.

Because I was very like, let's take it slow. Like he had brought up things like, oh, maybe I'll take you to a wedding with me in England. And I said, well, and that was like maybe two months in. And I said, well, let's not think that far ahead right now. Like, let's just like focus on getting to know each other.

So I feel like this relationship, like I talked to my therapist about it and she said, like, I've done everything I could and I've mitigated all the risks. And I took a chance and it just didn't work out.

It's so frustrating. And sorry, it's just like going forward. It's like, I don't know. I still care so much about this person that it's like hard to think. Like, I just really thought he was my person. Like I've never, sorry. I just have to like, you know, my voice sounds like that. I just like have never felt that way about anyone. Where to where I was like, wow, this is my guy.

Like he's my equal. I've never like been treated like that great to where I really like, you know, he inspired me and I felt like I inspired him. Like I felt like everything was going great until he just shut down on me. And I don't know. So like my question is just like, how do I like move forward and consider other people?

But it's like, I know it's like time is involved, but it's just, it's really hard when I have like this picture of him like popping back up later. You know what I mean?

Like, I feel like it's always, like, how it always goes. Like, as soon as you, like, get over somebody or, like, write them off, they pop back up, right?

Remember, it's an energy.

Yeah, it just feels like I'm like, I feel like I was a distraction for him versus like he wasn't ready. When I was very clear about my expectations early on, like I was like very ready to fall in love and find my person.

And he clearly wasn't like he said when I when he after he talked to a therapist the first time when we started having the issue was I don't think I can fall in love with anybody right now. Like I have a lot of processing to do still. And I'm like, well, I would have been great to know 11 months ago.

Yeah, I think he only struggles with it when it comes to saying I love you. My therapist said that he's thinking I love, like, From what I told her, she thinks that him saying I love you is like signing on the dotted line.

Which I brought up to him and I said, I think you're making it too big of a deal than it is.

Yeah. But it brought up him like not being ready. You know what I mean?

No, to like in general, like it brought up, he said like, this has just been too much too fast and yada yada. But a lot of it was propelled by him.

And he was able to tell me how he felt in other circumstances. We did multiple trips. We went to San Diego for our birthdays. And he told me at the end of the trip, I asked him, what was your favorite part? And he said, you know, like, this is going to sound cheesy, but just spending time with you has been great. Like, just being able to, like, do things and go out and have fun.

So, like, he can tell me in those ways. He just can't say it for some reason, which is... Makes me crazy.

No, because he got distant.

No, I think because I didn't bring that up until after he got distant because I hadn't really brought it up. Like, I only brought it up, like, when we were making big decisions and was like, how are you feeling? I didn't say, like, hey, I need you to say this. Like, I was just, like, assessing, like, and I think he got dissent after he put an offer in on a house and it didn't go that way.

And I'm glad, like, the inspection was bad because it would have been terrible if I would have moved in with him. Because I basically told him, like, hey, we're about to combine lives. Like, I just want to know where your feelings are at, like, that we're still on the same page and

like yeah absolutely so i was thinking he was gonna say it soon just like in a more romantic way because he's a very thoughtful guy he leaves me notes like my i think what kind of what made him like he went to christmas with me and my dad made him very uncomfortable one of the days we're there how so so it's kind of like a meet the fuckers kind of situation okay like

Um, so we were all standing around in the kitchen talking and he was like leaning by the counter and we're all like leaning on the counter but he was leaning by this new stove my parents got they were like, super excited about this stove they just bought it they had a stove cover for it which is like wood it's like a cutting board, and he was leaning on it I guess and then my mom's like oh my god the stoves on.

when he went to the bathroom and the stove turned on and burned through this new cutting board, they were all excited about, like left a mark on the bottom of it. And instead of my dad being like, Oh, no big deal. My dad was like, Oh my God, we could have set the house on fire. And like,

Went on and on and on about it the entire night and wouldn't let us change the subject and was like, so he had a few drinks and he can get a little obsessive. My dad can be a lot. I love him, but he can be a lot to be around and just made the whole situation worse.

very awkward for everyone and so and then i made a terrible joke at the end of the night trying to like lighten the tension with him and he didn't take it well but we like worked it out and talked about it and everything but i think after that like about a week after that is when he got started to get like distant and like weird yeah and i brought that up and he said well it didn't help but he didn't say it was the reason

So it's just more coming back.

And then cried about it.

Not at all. Because I think if I reached out to him, he would just confuse me more.

Thank you. I think I just needed to hear that because it's like I felt like good about it for the first month. And then when two months hit, I just like started questioning it and start going through the grieving process again. So where like I'm like just trying to keep trudging through and moving forward. But it's just like been tough because you go back and forth in your mind.

I think one of the things that's stressing me out is I'm starting a graduate program this year. And I know I'm not going to have any time for dating for the next three years. So it was like, I mean, You never know, right? But I'm going to be so busy and I'm excited that this happened before I started the program because I don't have time for like the distraction.

But it was just like, I don't know. He was like very supportive and I was excited to like have that support throughout the program. Yeah, but that's what I'm saying.

Well, we didn't talk about like, we didn't commiserate. I don't

Yeah. I feel like we did work through like a few small things, but nothing like crazy.

Well, he knew. He knew if he was honest about it, I would leave. Like I would be like, okay, you know.

That's what's so frustrating is I feel like guys like.

So, I don't know.

Yeah. I don't regret our relationship. It's just, you know, I've been, I've been getting out there. Like I've been going to volleyball and run club and meeting people. I've been asked on a few dates.

I just got to get through one more month and I move away and I'll be a little older.

I'm not. I'm going to the beach with my craft today.

But I still, you know, I'm not ready.

I asked him multiple times.

Yeah, maybe, maybe, maybe, I don't know.

You get riled up when I... Yes, because it's my anxiety because I look for things because I'm trying to make sure it's going to work before I invest feeling.

Exactly true. Because I saw in the beginning, he didn't take down his photos from his Facebook with his ex. And that bothered me. And I talked about it. And he finally did like five months in. But he was like, oh, I just don't go on Facebook. That was his excuse.

But then he took them down. Like he finally like.

Well, cause I asked, I just told him like how I felt.

Yeah.

That makes sense. That makes total sense. I think that's exactly what I needed to hear, honestly. So not that I'll be in the exact same situation again, but if I was in a situation similar, would you just recommend like taking it really slow or like just being like, Pressing instincts and being like.

Well, yeah, but I just mean in instincts in general. Because usually if something comes up, I try to talk to somebody about it and see how they're feeling. Because I don't want to read into something that I don't know. Because there's always something that comes up.

No. And I didn't know all the details until about, Like not even all the details.

It is. I do want to say one little thing though.

When he originally said six months, he also said, well, we've been having issues for years and it made it seem like he had like slowly like displaced himself over years. And I was like, well, I can relate to that because sometimes you're done with the relationship before it fully ends.

You know what I mean? So it's just like, I know.

No, my first date.

I just didn't want to feel like I was splitting hairs and asking for so many details. I was just trying to have fun and get to know him.

Yeah, I understand.

This call is really helpful. Really helpful.

Friend date, but.

I would fight for him if he would fight for

Well, thank you. I appreciate it so much.

Yeah, I'll give you an update. All right. Thank you.

You too. Bye.