Nathalie Kittroweth

has opposed for a very long time.

Just explain why that's been the case.

Right.

The push to oust Maduro just did not work.

And the question for a long time now has been, how far is the U.S.

willing to go to get rid of Maduro?

For the Trump administration now, it seems as though that threshold is changing.

They seem much more willing to do something that they weren't back in 2019, which is use military force.

And that's why you're saying that things seem so much different in this moment.

And so how did we get here to the point where now the threat of military force is very much on the table?

And that's the state of play, basically, right, when Trump comes into office in January.

Maduro has held on to power, even though at this point the whole world basically believes that he has stolen this election.

So what does Trump do?

Did you say deliver all the natural resources of Venezuela to the U.S.?

That would essentially be Venezuela doing a complete 180 on its foreign policy and ceding control over its most valuable resources to the U.S.

Can you just explain why Maduro and his government would agree to that?

This does seem like exactly the kind of transactional extractive deal that Trump has favored in the past.

You know, pay me and we'll help you out.

So I assume that this seems like a pretty good offer.

We'll be right back.