Omer Bartov

It's a rather, you know, fascist notion of demographics.

Exactly, which means that if people live in better conditions, if they're better educated, they want a higher standard of living, then they tend to have fewer children.

In the 1980s, this was spoken about in Israel as the demographic bomb was that Israel was controlling so many Palestinians and soon there would be more children.

Palestinians than Israelis.

And in fact, the ratio remained the same.

And the reason it remained the same, 50-50, is that Orthodox Jews started producing vast numbers of children, about the average of about 12 children per family.

And as that population has grown, in fact, fertility within the Jewish part of the country has grown faster than among Palestinians.

Whereas Palestinians who are Israeli citizens, two million of them have had far fewer children than they did in the past for this reason that they're better educated, that they want to have a higher standard of living.

And so this kind of nowadays in Israel, the liberal part of.

of Jewish citizens is saying we have lost the struggle, not against the Palestinians, but against the Orthodox.

And that's part of what is happening in Israel now, that indeed Judaism as such has been hijacked by a particular group of people who are also having many children, among other things, who have created the kind of Judaism that is more like the zealots of Roman times than today, which is Jewish supremacist and extremely violent.

Look, I think it can, but I must say, and I write that in the book, Zionism, which began as a movement of emancipation, liberation of Jews as a minority, a persecuted minority in Eastern Europe, has transformed itself now into racist, Jewish supremacist ideology of the state.

that has now justified genocide.

And I think for that reason, Israel, which will remain, of course, it's a state, it's internationally recognized, but if it wants to be a member of the international community, if it wants to provide a good life for its own citizens, it has to dump Israel.

Zionism put it where it belongs to the garbage heap of history and recreate itself as a country that is just and fair and equal to all its citizens.