Rebecca Winthrop

Absolutely. And the key is what you said, contain the system. We can't sort of just bring commercial tech into our schools and hope it will solve these problems. It has to have guardrails. We have to make sure that the data that it's being trained on is legit and not going to create harmful prompts for kids.

We've seen terrible things with commercial AI companions, with young people developing relationships and being really manipulated emotionally. But you can put guardrails. It's totally possible. It's just where, who, what the, frankly, it gets back to the incentives. It gets back to the business model, which is where you, you know, regulation and government could and should step in.

We've seen terrible things with commercial AI companions, with young people developing relationships and being really manipulated emotionally. But you can put guardrails. It's totally possible. It's just where, who, what the, frankly, it gets back to the incentives. It gets back to the business model, which is where you, you know, regulation and government could and should step in.

So yes, if contained is the question.

So yes, if contained is the question.

We 100% want kids to have the capacity for deep attention. And you're thinking about your own kiddos who are young. And I'm thinking about my own teenagers who are 13 and 16. And I see... the undermining of attentive faculties from when my 16-year-old got his phone.

We 100% want kids to have the capacity for deep attention. And you're thinking about your own kiddos who are young. And I'm thinking about my own teenagers who are 13 and 16. And I see... the undermining of attentive faculties from when my 16-year-old got his phone.

For a long time, he didn't want a phone because I'd been droning on and on for years because he has me as a mother about addiction and opportunity costs and just that, you know, it's okay to enjoy it a little bit, but, you know, can't sacrifice sleep and physical exercise and in-person, you know, communication. And then he did get his phone and he struggles with it.

For a long time, he didn't want a phone because I'd been droning on and on for years because he has me as a mother about addiction and opportunity costs and just that, you know, it's okay to enjoy it a little bit, but, you know, can't sacrifice sleep and physical exercise and in-person, you know, communication. And then he did get his phone and he struggles with it.

And he says, mom, this is really hard. It's eroding his ability to do his homework or to follow something he wants to do. The only thing that it doesn't seem to distract him from doing is playing the piano because he loves playing the piano. So anything that we can do to actually ensure young people are developing the muscle to And it's not just attention. Attention is the entry point.

And he says, mom, this is really hard. It's eroding his ability to do his homework or to follow something he wants to do. The only thing that it doesn't seem to distract him from doing is playing the piano because he loves playing the piano. So anything that we can do to actually ensure young people are developing the muscle to And it's not just attention. Attention is the entry point.

That's the doorway that gets you through. It's actually reflection and meaning-making, which is what you get from deep reading and reading full books, which a lot of young people struggle to do today. You also can get it from other means. You could get it from long Socratic dialogues in community with diverse people over time, but it has to be...

That's the doorway that gets you through. It's actually reflection and meaning-making, which is what you get from deep reading and reading full books, which a lot of young people struggle to do today. You also can get it from other means. You could get it from long Socratic dialogues in community with diverse people over time, but it has to be...

An experience where you reflect, you think about meaning, you think about different perspectives, and it changes how you see the world.

An experience where you reflect, you think about meaning, you think about different perspectives, and it changes how you see the world.

Yes, yes.

Yes, yes.

I think that's right. If I had to choose for my own kids, and I do, we would have, you know, a school that has no phones for all the reasons we know. And Jonathan Haidt has done a great job on sort of catalyzing that movement here in the U.S., and bringing it from across the globe to our schools. We should have cell phone bands in school, bell to bell.

I think that's right. If I had to choose for my own kids, and I do, we would have, you know, a school that has no phones for all the reasons we know. And Jonathan Haidt has done a great job on sort of catalyzing that movement here in the U.S., and bringing it from across the globe to our schools. We should have cell phone bands in school, bell to bell.

Don't have it at recess because that's where you start interacting and playing with kids. And I think we should make school a place where kids can actually interact with each other, develop human-to-human socialization capacities because there is massive commercial tech the minute they leave school that is vying for their attention. And make sure, make sure to do some high-quality AI literacy.