Rory Sutherland

On the former, it's trite, but you'll say it.

Any of, you know, obviously the core model companies, though, yes, it's easy to say on Tropic, you almost don't get any points for that.

I do believe, so I'll pick some harder ones.

I do believe the many of the quote-unquote rapper type opportunities, I'm deliberately using the pejorative.

I do believe there's many compelling enterprise applications to be built on top of those and all the apps that will compound durably, even if the growth, even, oh my God, I can't believe I said that, if the growth is 3x, 4x, 2x even, right?

I think, you know, you've mentioned the legal case.

We have an investment there, GCAI, Harvey, all those things I think are going to compound.

There might be competition, but those are great categories.

I think the obvious example of things that we'll have to transition the business model to compound are many of the consumer-led high growth, ultra high growth, but uncompelling margins, creative tools, some of the stuff like that, maybe where they will have to morph the model.

I'm not saying they won't, but what you show up with in the end will be different than what you're showing up with now.

I like your answer, Jason, because I want to pick it apart.

Because what we're basically saying is Salesforce and HubSpot are extraordinarily low valued public companies in the CRM space.

There's a whole bunch of VCs funding a whole bunch of next generation CRM companies at 50 or 100 times revenues.

How do you reconcile those two things?

And what, Jason, you put forward is two theories.

One theory is the dad theory, which is poor old VCs, all they understand is CRM, so we're just doing a new CRM.

And implicit in what you're saying is, and I agree with you, by the way, if the new CRM is pretty much the old CRM, but with some AI bells and whistles,

it will fail for two reasons.

The first is the old CRM growth rate has slowed because the market's saturated.

So now you're trying to do a replacement sale of a slightly better product, even if it has some pretty AI features.